The Life Cycle of the Gun Debate in the U.S. - Comment #1,529,655

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Kung Fu Cthulhu
Kung Fu Cthulhu

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

@ Tom Brock: I was speaking at the national level – at the state level, things seem to be getting better depending on where you are, but on a national level, there is a lot of work to be desired. Even after Sandy Hook, in which fucking kids were gunned down, Congress wouldn’t even pass the law on improved background checks due to the NRA’s influence. Bear in mind that that the idea of establishing better background checks is something that Democratic and Republican voters agree is necessary. The bureaucracy is in the way, and because of it, more people are going to be gunned down to protect the interests of gun manufacturers.

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Quintus Aelius Lurco Cato
Quintus Aelius Lurco Cato

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

That’s a fair argument I guess but have you even considered that inattentiveness is at all at fault, or the lack of adequately armed security. The columbine shooters proclaimed they were going to go a shooting spree at least a few days before they did. To cite another famous school shooting Virginia Tech the shooter, Seung-Hui Cho, had well know mental problems and many at the collage took note of his mental state. He even sent pictures of himself hold fully armed to NBC on the day of the shooting and something like 100 pictures and a manifesto was found in his room. Do we see a problem here? Sure gun laws might help keep, but do you see other problems here to. Like with holding certain crucial information.

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Kung Fu Cthulhu
Kung Fu Cthulhu

in reply to Quintus Aelius Lurco Cato

As a person that grew up almost entirely under the post-Columbine education system, I was fully aware of the ultra-conservative environment that schools promoted – I remember that teachers would hop on your ass if you so much as joked “I’ll kill you” to a friend. I think that teachers quickly learned from that incident in that regard, even if they became extremely tight-assed in the process. As for the other note, Cho’s photos didn’t get sent until after he had killed people, unfortunately. I’d imagine that a number of people he’d known simply thought he was weird and/or creepy and in need of counseling instead of gun-crazy.

I’m not saying there’s exclusively one problem in all of this tragedy, but I am saying that the actual weapons used are the biggest factor to be concerned about.

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Chickenhound the Cruel
Chickenhound the Cruel

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

While I am in favor of background checks, there is some legitimate fears on what Congress will define as a background check.

Congress has been mostly for two extremes, and people’s definition of splitting it down the middle has been rather crazed and hazy. I am certain people would be in favor of more rigorous background checks if there wasn’t a political worry of the law getting man handled by god knows what that passes through and writes stuff in and out of it.

Then there is some other concern. A lot of times, the guns used in shootings like these are not actually bought legally, and for the most part end up in the hands of crazed men through their parents, mostly accidentally or out of mind. Kind of like what happened to that Preschool, the murderer had simply grabbed his mother’s gun and began a rampage, and I doubt there would be no way to guard against that.

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dan_nye
dan_nye

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

You had no argument to begin with. You talk about Cho’s mental instability, then conclude that the weapons used at VT are the biggest concern and whine about the NRA.

You call for for “better background checks” and cite supposed bipartisan desire, without mentioning any of the privacy and due process issues raised by bipartisan parties, concerns which directly led to the demise of the proposals.

And lastly you assume those proposals would actually achieve the goals of decreased violence without any kind of proof. Fucking kids is not legitimate proof.

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Victory
Victory

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

Let’s be broader here, though. The national homicide rate was decreasing steadily for decades.

However, the number of mass shootings led by psychopaths exploded within the last 5 years. So what is it? I’m blaming another major problem in America that is growing.

Also, there is NO correlation between the number of guns available per capita and the homicide, violent crime, and suicide rate in the US, so going straight for my guns isn’t the answer. Stay back.

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Kung Fu Cthulhu
Kung Fu Cthulhu

in reply to dan_nye

Because most people involved in school shootings are obviously obtaining their weapons legally.

In all seriousness, I have not said that restricting guns is exclusively the way to go. These weapons are much too easily accessed if people can go in and steal them overnight. I’d certainly be in favor of laws concerning better security in facilities that sell guns.

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dan_nye
dan_nye

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

Oh noes, the school shooters are obtaining their weapons legally. Let’s make it illegal for everyone else to get weapons.

I’m not even going to play the compromise game. The gun community has given up 90% of our gun rights since 1934 and got nothing in return but constant demonization and threats to take the remaining 10%, and still we have zero proof that gun laws do anything to decrease crime.

Even the recent trend of allowing concealed carry, being literally the only gun rights fight we have won in the last 80 years, was greeted with massive contempt from the gun-grabbers warning of blood in the streets and duels at noon. None of this occurred.

From now on, every single proposition on any sort of gun law should be prefaced with definitive proof of their effectiveness in decreasing crime as well as their Constitutional validity, or be dismissed without consideration.

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Victory
Victory

in reply to Kung Fu Cthulhu

Most, if not all school shooters were diagnosed with some mental illness, which means that gun ownership concerning those with mental issues is the real problem. So yes, I want better “securities” when it comes to purchasing guns if someone with a “mental” history wants to purchase, but let’s keep it down to that. dan_nye is saying that ALL the gun owners will get hurt if measures are taken, so I only want reform on gun purchases concerning mental health, and no more.

However, mental health is a gray area that frustrates everyone. These psychopaths that kill people look and act normal during the purchase, so even reforms wouldn’t do anything. I don’t know, man.

Thanks for the constructive response.
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