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Judgment call: is this a banning offense?

Last posted Sep 17, 2012 at 09:25AM EDT. Added Aug 15, 2012 at 02:33PM EDT
40 posts from 15 users

Not naming names--because it’s easy enough to scroll down and find--but a user posted a comment on this entry that received over 40 downvotes, and another user commented that they should be banned for what they said. I looked at the comment, and while I see that it was quite offensive, I don’t see that it violated any rules or otherwise warranted banning. Still, with over 40 downvotes, I thought I’d bring it to the attention of the other mods and see if anyone disagrees.

Aug 15, 2012 at 02:33PM EDT
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While the comment in question was not a bannable offense imo, all the brony-attacking in his history is. Random banned him this morning.

Last edited Aug 15, 2012 at 02:43PM EDT
Aug 15, 2012 at 02:43PM EDT
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I know you were hoping for a mod’s input on this. And unfortunately I am not a mod
The user in question is already banned. Not sure who banned him.

And he is technically breaking rule number 6 (forum rules and comments), I’ve checked KYM forum rules and entry guidelines. Banning him was ultimately a good idea.

He could’ve shared his ideas and opinions in that entry without those harsh words.
So the ban was a good idea. If you banned him or any other mod, it was the right choice

edit: dang, amandab posted while I was slow typing
edit 2: thanks to Natsuru re: 6

Last edited Aug 15, 2012 at 02:57PM EDT
Aug 15, 2012 at 02:49PM EDT
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Might I remind everyone of rule number 6;
Be friendly. We want our forums to be welcoming place for both old and new users. Please keep your comments and posts constructive and considerate in tone. If you observe a user breaking a rule, try advising the user in the right direction instead of posting insults or harsh criticisms. If the user persists, contact a forum moderator.

I am not certain if this applies to the comments section (I haven’t been able to find a link to the Rules via a Comments section yet), but if it doesn’t I don’t see why the hell not.

As for it being a Bannable offense: Only if it happens on multiple occasions as this user has done.

Last edited Aug 15, 2012 at 02:55PM EDT
Aug 15, 2012 at 02:54PM EDT
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Ah, perhaps a moot point then. Still, This might be a good topic to discuss in a more general sense once again. Does anyone think there are actions that should invoke a ban that don’t explicitly break the rules? And what about the occasional forum regular who breaks a rule, but we let it slide because we know they’re joking or whatever?

I never pooled for opinions on whether my decision to not treat this thread as spam was a good one, yet I was curious what others thought about it.

EDIT:
@IvanP91v, I’m always open to hear all opinions. I’ve always felt that we mods aren’t more important, just a little more powerful.

Last edited Aug 15, 2012 at 03:02PM EDT
Aug 15, 2012 at 02:56PM EDT
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just putting my opinion here,

my experiences of being on the internet (and perhaps for a lot of other people) has generally been that there are no boundaries or limits for anything that can be deemed offensive. anyone can say anything, regardless of consequence, or anything else for that matter, under the terms of “freedom of speech” or “everyone is just too butthurt”.

a friend of mine jokingly said, “when you are on the internet, you are assumed to be a white atheist male in your 20-30s and everyone else is born to be the butt of your joke”

at times i know that is true, otherwise a lot of memes would not exist because of this and communicating on the internet would change for better or worse. but in the end i do feel there should be some line somewhere. somewhere.

in no way do i mean this as an “everyone is evil i can’t stand you all i am on a moral high ground arg grrrrrAAAAARRRGHGghG” kind of post, i’m just putting my opinion here.

Aug 15, 2012 at 04:04PM EDT
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Natsuru Springfield wrote:

Might I remind everyone of rule number 6;
Be friendly. We want our forums to be welcoming place for both old and new users. Please keep your comments and posts constructive and considerate in tone. If you observe a user breaking a rule, try advising the user in the right direction instead of posting insults or harsh criticisms. If the user persists, contact a forum moderator.

I am not certain if this applies to the comments section (I haven’t been able to find a link to the Rules via a Comments section yet), but if it doesn’t I don’t see why the hell not.

As for it being a Bannable offense: Only if it happens on multiple occasions as this user has done.

The forum rules apply throughout the whole site.

Aug 15, 2012 at 04:41PM EDT
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amanda b. wrote:

The forum rules apply throughout the whole site.

Well then, I guess the Banning is justified then.
--

But it would be good if the people who only use the comments section where able to access the rules via the Comments Section. Perhaps put a link in the Pop Up Box Window underneath the Type Window? (Like how the Forums have the “What is a Textile?” link)

Aug 15, 2012 at 04:56PM EDT
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Looking through his Activity, I say he did need the Ban.
More importantly did he learn a lesson from this.
Most likely not.
He may either stop coming to the site, or when he does comeback, for whatever reason, continue his ways.
Anyway, Bans, and Deactivated Accounts are reversible. (As I know from personal experiance)

Last edited Aug 15, 2012 at 05:33PM EDT
Aug 15, 2012 at 05:32PM EDT
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In regards to DurrHey, I believe he deserved the ban because it seemed his sole purpose for joining the site was to create shitstorms with bronies and various other people as well. If that was his actual opinion, then that wouldn’t warrant a ban. People should ultimately be respectful when stating a less popular opinion, but you can’t ban someone for their opinion regardless. However, that just didn’t seem to be the case.


I never pooled for opinions on whether my decision to not treat this thread as spam was a good one, yet I was curious what others thought about it.

In all honesty, I was pretty disappointed that you left that thread open. Not because I disagreed with the OP’s intent (I did, but that’s another story), but because you agreed with him. I feel that if that thread had the exact opposite intent (i.e. a petition to take Piratebay down for illegal material), you would have locked it as spam within the snap of a finger.

You did mention that the community had interest in it, but that goes along with what I said about DurrHey. You can’t ban someone for their opinion, no matter how unpopular it is. Same with threads. You can’t lock them because they’re unpopular IMO. Thus, I think that should have been locked for spam, like any similar thread would have been.


And what about the occasional forum regular who breaks a rule, but we let it slide because we know they’re joking or whatever?

In most cases, I would say that you should just lock it and leave a post saying not to do it again. However, some of the forum users here (i.e. RF) create spam threads for the sole purpose of annoying the mods and some of the users here (i.e. myself). So for repeat offenders, I think that would deserve a ban.

Last edited Aug 16, 2012 at 12:32AM EDT
Aug 16, 2012 at 12:11AM EDT
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Muffins wrote:

In all honesty, I was pretty disappointed that you left that thread open. Not because I disagreed with the OP’s intent (I did, but that’s another story), but because you agreed with him. I feel that if that thread had the exact opposite intent (i.e. a petition to take Piratebay down for illegal material), you would have locked it as spam within the snap of a finger.

I find this paragraph confusing. First, are you saying that what bothered you was that you felt I was being a hypocrite? That would make some sense, but it sounds like you’re saying it’s bad for me to not lock threads I like. I’m probably reading it wrong (although if I’m not, it so happens that on one or two occasions, I have locked threads that I liked but were clearly violating forum rules).

Second, I’m not sure where you got the idea that I agreed with the OP in that thread. I think piracy is wrong, and I felt that I expressed that several times in the thread. I do think that those who break the law should have the chance to defend themselves, but letting someone go unpunished because popular opinion is that they shouldn’t be punished? That’s really iffy. I also think that we’re seeing far too many instances of people running sites like the Pirate Bay getting punished far beyond what’s reasonable, however. But this second point is tangential to the theme of this thread so I’ll move on…

Third, setting all that aside, I happen to like to see open discussion about issues, and by definition that includes those who happen to disagree with me. Since I did happen to disagree with the aims of that petition, I hope that’s clear enough. I’ll tell you something I don’t think I’ve said before: if I upvote or downvote a post on the forums, it’s not based on whether I agree or disagree with the opinion stated, but whether the opinion was expressed in a polite, intelligent manner. What I think I have said before is that there are few things that annoy me quite like someone who shares my opinion but expresses it in a dickish manner.

So with what I hope was a clarification of my own view on the matter, do you still think I was wrong to let the thread stand? (I don’t mind being wrong, so long as I’m wrong for legitimate reasons.) I just figure people on this forum are more likely to have interesting opinions on Pirate Bay than African Mango supplements.

Aug 16, 2012 at 06:12AM EDT
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@Brucker

I find this paragraph confusing. First, are you saying that what bothered you was that you felt I was being a hypocrite? That would make some sense, but it sounds like you’re saying it’s bad for me to not lock threads I like.

What I was trying to say was that a thread of the opposite nature would have been locked as spam by another mod, at the very least. So not locking that thread displayed the forums as biased towards a certain opinion.

Second, I’m not sure where you got the idea that I agreed with the OP in that thread.

I was basing that off your first post in the thread, as that was the one that declared your motives for keeping it open. You described it as “a charitable cause”, so it was easy to misunderstand.

I happen to like to see open discussion about issues

I can understand this, but why not just lock the thread and open your own asking for everyone’s opinions on the matter? The problem is that since that thread was declared as pro-Piratebay in the OP, that gave people larger justification to neg anti-Piratebay opinions. And by hovering your mouse over some of the karma scores, you can see that many of them were negged in large amounts, while the pro-Piratebay opinions weren’t negged at all.

A thread with a neutral OP would have created a more open place to host that discussion.

Last edited Aug 16, 2012 at 09:31AM EDT
Aug 16, 2012 at 09:04AM EDT
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amanda b. wrote:

While the comment in question was not a bannable offense imo, all the brony-attacking in his history is. Random banned him this morning.

Yeah, this basically. I won’t mind once or twice. If it’s really insulting or racist, send him a PM with a warning. But continiously doing this may warrant a ban. Same with personally attacking users for whatever reason. As Natsuru pointed out about the site rules, such behavior doesn’t create a welcoming atmosphere.

Last edited Aug 16, 2012 at 09:59AM EDT
Aug 16, 2012 at 09:58AM EDT
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@Muffins:

What I was trying to say was that a thread of the opposite nature would have been locked as spam by another mod, at the very least. So not locking that thread displayed the forums as biased towards a certain opinion.

Well, I don’t know if that is the case, but it certainly may be possible. I tend to think that most of the other mods would have locked that one as well. Nonetheless, these sorts of issues come up often (especially when it comes to political matters) and I have always said that there probably is a bias--just because bias is pretty much always there in any situation--but my hope is that we are aware of our biases and try not to let it cloud our judgment when it comes to moderation matters.

I was basing that off your first post in the thread, as that was the one that declared your motives for keeping it open. You described it as “a charitable cause”, so it was easy to misunderstand.

I guess I can see how that gave the impression, so I wish I had a better term. To me, “a charitable cause” is someone asking for donations of money or effort to something they consider a worthy purpose rather than selling a product. By such a definition, the KKK is technically “a charitable cause”, but I’m pretty sure I would have locked a thread on that subject.

I can understand this, but why not just lock the thread and open your own asking for everyone’s opinions on the matter? The problem is that since that thread was declared as pro-Piratebay in the OP, that gave people larger justification to neg anti-Piratebay opinions. And by hovering your mouse over some of the karma scores, you can see that many of them were negged in large amounts, while the pro-Piratebay opinions weren’t negged at all.

Actually, what I would have really preferred would have been to offer a link someplace where one could officially express a dissenting opinion. I’ve actually always had a bit of a dislike for petitions, because while they are ostensibly a form of free speech, they are by their very nature one-sided. I somehow got on some conservative organization’s mailing list, and they sent me a link to a petition to repeal Obamacare; I wrote them back and asked where the pro-Obamacare petition could be found. I never got a response, go figure.

We have no control over how individual users dole out their kramas, but I’ve tried to encourage people to do so in the manner I described above: Don’t downvote someone just because you disagree with what they are saying, but rather if you feel they have made no significant contribution to the discussion. For instance, I disagreed strongly with Kalmo in that thread, but rather than downvoting his post, I responded to it. As far as I’m concerned, that’s the only way to send a clear message; a downvote says “I didn’t like what you said,” but it doesn’t say why.

Aug 17, 2012 at 05:13AM EDT
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is this a bannable offense?

http://knowyourmeme.com/users/2yugeinnad
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/keem-chong-ilests

Aug 17, 2012 at 04:38PM EDT
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Kim Jong Is Swaggin wrote:

is this a bannable offense?

http://knowyourmeme.com/users/2yugeinnad
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/keem-chong-ilests

Yep. Creating an alt just to harass another user is definitely bannable, and it’s been taken care of.

Aug 17, 2012 at 04:45PM EDT
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Kim Jong Is Swaggin wrote:

is this a bannable offense?

http://knowyourmeme.com/users/2yugeinnad
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/keem-chong-ilests

Bannable offense? I’m gonna make that guy a mod!

Aug 17, 2012 at 06:26PM EDT
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Brucker wrote:

That feel when a Brand New Member posts a link to his website, and mods don’t lock the thread.

It was related to a single topic blog which had a lot in common with other blogs we have entries for, thus I found it somewhat related to this site (we’re still a meme site, although the forum often makes us forget this). He added the link in case people were interested (I was the person who made it a hyperlink, not him), but besides that was mainly asking for ideas, not views.

But alright, I apologize, and I locked it.

Last edited Aug 21, 2012 at 09:06AM EDT
Aug 21, 2012 at 09:05AM EDT
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If you wish. I was really just giving you a bad time for lulz.

Aug 21, 2012 at 03:29PM EDT
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I think the user in question definitely deserved the ban. Not only have I firsthand witnessed him attacking and harassing bronies (as well as having issues with me, a modest brony, once), but I can recall him insulting athiests and just rustling jimmies in general. I hope that he will be given time to think about the way he uses this site, and hopefully upon return, assuming he decides to come back, things will have changed.

Aug 22, 2012 at 09:55AM EDT
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@trollkeeper

an obvious troll won’t change his ways……….using the same account, if he genuinely wanted to come back to KYM and contribute to it without anyone being suspicious or wary of his actions, he might as well make a new account

Aug 22, 2012 at 07:20PM EDT
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Kim Jong Is Swaggin wrote:

@trollkeeper

an obvious troll won’t change his ways……….using the same account, if he genuinely wanted to come back to KYM and contribute to it without anyone being suspicious or wary of his actions, he might as well make a new account

Well, shit. You strike a fair point.

Aug 23, 2012 at 02:18AM EDT
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@Kim Jong:

Seriously though, there are a surprising number of users that started out essentially as trolls, but later became productive members of the community. I would actually consider you to be on that list to some extent, except you were never trollish enough to warrant a ban, which would be more indicative of a major turnaround. I’m sure there are more users that don’t simply pop into mind, but RussianFedora and 404UserNotFound are two members that went through a very annoying trolling phase early on, but now are quite well-accepted. That’s another important reason why I think users who break the rules should always get another chance (unless they’re obvious spambots).

Aug 23, 2012 at 02:33AM EDT
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“I would actually consider you to be on that list to some extent”
yeah I was being a mean-ass at first for some reason
then Randomman called me out on it (thank you)
and now I am truly an hero

but back to trolls and bannable behavior
anyone who makes another “DIS IS ASSUM MEEMEE” entry should be instabanned, just make a code banning anyone who makes an entry using that exact title, and don’t tell them about the code so they don’t know whats going on, leaving these trolls in frustration

another insta-ban should be one-word-description entries
you think this might accidentally hurt an innocent user, well trust me, an innocent user will NOT leave the body of his entry with the one word “meme” as the many idiots have done already.

these ones are one-simple-sentence descriptions
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/somewhat-threatening-atif
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/stalker

they knew what they were doing, ban them

that or have the body simply say the title of the meme
(http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/everyone-chill-the-fuck-out-i-got-this)
like seriously, how do these people manage to breathe?

another insta-ban:
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/training-for-the-hunger-games
now I know you guys want to think that these guys are doing this in good faith, they’re just ill-informed but have good intentions and have just made a simple mistake

but no, they’re well informed, and have shitty intentions, ban them

Last edited Aug 23, 2012 at 12:05PM EDT
Aug 23, 2012 at 12:05PM EDT
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No, unfortunately, but his/her last post says, “Fuck this, I’m leaving this site.” Hopefully they mean it, because I don’t think they will be missed.

Aug 24, 2012 at 12:48PM EDT
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@Brucker

Okay, thank you for answering my question, Brucker.

Aug 24, 2012 at 12:58PM EDT

Brucker wrote:

No, unfortunately, but his/her last post says, “Fuck this, I’m leaving this site.” Hopefully they mean it, because I don’t think they will be missed.

I actually disagree with that. As rule 6 states, we want KYM to be a welcoming place. Users that do nothing more than being complaining dicks don’t really support that. As with the person discussed in the OP post, we have warned and banned multiple users in the past who did nothing more with their account than attack bronies. Although this is something different, it is still somewhat related to dickish behavior, so I still say a warning should be given (which I already gave btw).

Aug 24, 2012 at 03:58PM EDT
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Well, I guess I’d have a hard time banning someone just for being obnoxious, but with that level of complaining, I might be inclined to suggest, “You know, I can see what the problem is here; what you need to do to enhance your enjoyment of KYM is press Alt+F4, which opens up a whole bunch of great options! Try it now!”

Aug 25, 2012 at 11:08PM EDT
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http://knowyourmeme.com/users/strongbutt

see the types of comments in his activities, very drewpickles-esque purposeful trolling

Sep 05, 2012 at 01:33AM EDT
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Deus Ex Machina wrote:

“Commented on Doctor Who.
Shit show
Horrible Fandom
Bring on the dislikes
2 days ago”

That brony will pay.

I shall make sure of that.

It’s OK to voice unpopular opinions, as I think has been stated earlier in the thread, but just full-on attacking a fandom like that?

I suggest a warning from a mod. If this continues, by all means, bring on the banhammer. Seriously, this is how some bronies give the rest of us a bad name on the site.

Sep 08, 2012 at 06:45PM EDT
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Deus Ex Machina wrote:

“Commented on Doctor Who.
Shit show
Horrible Fandom
Bring on the dislikes
2 days ago”

That brony will pay.

I shall make sure of that.

Please don’t support that type of behavior.

Sep 09, 2012 at 09:29PM EDT
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RandomMan wrote:

Please don’t support that type of behavior.

He got banned.

I hadn’t planned on doing anything, anyways.

Sep 10, 2012 at 03:14PM EDT
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I noticed that [redacted] still makes comments on Facebook harassing bronies and the like.

I actually took a screen cap of him asking why he was banned in the comment section:

Last edited Sep 15, 2012 at 04:10PM EDT
Sep 15, 2012 at 04:01PM EDT
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@PinkTokyo

I think the option there is to simply ignore him. No point in telling him to stop, he’ll eventually give up if he doesn’t get a reaction.

Last edited Sep 16, 2012 at 07:10PM EDT
Sep 16, 2012 at 07:09PM EDT


Bans for everyone!

Edit: But seriously. Shouldn’t bans be a last resort. Shouldn’t deleted post be before this, but then after obvious failure, a ban should be given. Users should be given warnings, then bans.

Last edited Sep 16, 2012 at 10:16PM EDT
Sep 16, 2012 at 10:11PM EDT
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@EFP:
In a thread some time ago, I advocated for a sort of three-strikes system:
1 – Get a warning.
2 – Get another warning and a temporary ban.
3 – Permanent ban.

Everyone seemed to like the idea, but I don’t know that it was ever implemented in any official capacity.

Sep 17, 2012 at 02:37AM EDT
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The Cute Master :3 wrote:


Bans for everyone!

Edit: But seriously. Shouldn’t bans be a last resort. Shouldn’t deleted post be before this, but then after obvious failure, a ban should be given. Users should be given warnings, then bans.

Like Brucker said, we do give warnings first (it’s even mod policy). Though take in mind that with advertising and huge porn spammers we act on the spot, no warnings involved (I don’t think I should justify this, the reason is pretty clear). Sure, some mods might do with a warning more or less regarding the situation they’re dealing with and their judgement on it, but we don’t ban just because they made a funny face at us, don’t worry.

Last edited Sep 17, 2012 at 09:29AM EDT
Sep 17, 2012 at 09:25AM EDT
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Skeletor-sm

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