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![File: orange transparent chains(..).png (3.01 MB, 680x976) O LEGO Space 1995 Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)02:29:35 No.67744810 E GREETINGS FELLOW 90'S KIDS, I've spent my afternoon brainstorming about turning the LEGO Space themes from 1978 until around 2000 into a unified, coherent homebrew setting, and this is what I've come up with. (I'm sure something like this has been attempted before, so if it has, feel free to discuss that as well) https://lego.fandom.com/wiki/Space The lego themes from that era generally shared a narrative, but there's only so deep the lore gets for a series of toy blocks. I've tried to flesh them out a little bit to get kind of a basic idea of what a fully fledged RPG setting would look like, but it's just the basic skeleton. I don't have a particular system in mind, but something like Genesys could do the job. I'll go into the lore in a sec, but here are my general observations about themes: In the spirit of being inspired by kid's toys, the setting would be generally upbeat and adventurous but with some cyberpunk undertones. Guns don't shoot bullets, they shoot flashy lasers. The "bad guys" aren't murderous psychopaths, they're spies and thieves. Violence and vulgarity still exists, but this isn't a "dark reboot"; the goal is to maintain the spirit of the source material. All the figures are wearing space suits and there's not a plant or animal to be seen. To me, this says deep space colonization in a galaxy where teraforming doesn't exist or isn't effective (or hasn't had time to work yet). This might not be ubiquitously true, but generally speaking, most colonies would be sealed habitats with maybe small-to-moderate sized cities on the more populated worlds. That said, I see it as mostly post-scarcity; the people in the colonies don't so much worry about where their next meal is coming from, but they do worry about being caught outside with a cracked helmet. (1/3) O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)02:30:01 No.67744816 File: Futuron.jpg (116 KB, 613x690) 5828 LEGO >>67744810 (2/3) The earlier Classic Space sets, the Futuron sets, and Space Police I sets all wear very similar uniforms. Blacktron had a massive style change between Blacktron I and II. These things are noted in the lore framework. LEGO kept making Space sets well past 2000, but they stop being part of the same "canon". For the purposes of this, anything after Rock Raiders is considered a different setting (I'm even hesitant about including RR) So here's my very, very basic framework: Futuron is one of the great mega-corporations of Earth. Earth itself may not be dead or abandoned, but it is distant and mostly irrelevant; think StarCraft. Ages ago, Futuron set forth to colonize deep space. The early, classic Space sets represent the early days of the colonies, when you lived, breathed, and died a Futuron employee (with the Space Police I sets being the early Security division of Futuron.) These days, while Futuron is still the biggest influence in the colonies, they are not alone. Now that the colonies are beginning to thrive, more corporate interests have begun to move in, establishing rivalries or partnerships with each other and Futuron. In the interest of establishing a neutral, third party judiciary force, the colonies created the Space Police (Space Police II) though Futuron still maintains its own security force with whom they occasionally butt heads. Blacktron I started as an off-the-books black agency under Futuron, doing shady secret bad guy stuff. Blacktron was a nickname that stuck (originally a portmanteau of Black Futuron). There was an incident - a scandal of some sort - that exposed Blacktron, and Futuron cut them loose to save face and distance themselves from whatever the controversy was. But doing so seriously weakened the economic and political standing of Futuron. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)02:31:04 No.67744824 File: spyrius.jpg (445 KB, 1520x1227) >>67744810 >>67744816 (3/3) In the modern day, Blacktron (represented by Blacktron II) has embraced their exposure and Futuron's bad press, and has established themselves as a "legitimate" rival corporation, aggressively moving to acquire Futuron assets and colonies. They claim to have cleaned up their act, but they're shifty af. (Think Cerberus in the Mass Effect franchise) M:Tron is a corp that's moved in/built itself up as a major labor and engineering interest, mining vast resources with their proprietary Magnitron technology. They're rivals with Futuron, but mostly peaceful. Spyrius is a group of outlaws and pirates operating from the planet of the same name (Spyrius), they are the ostensible "main villains" but they have more in common with groups like COBRA (GI Joe) or HYDRA/AIM (Marvel) than a full on rival military. Their MO is mostly espionage and subterfuge with a healthy dose of piracy and theft. Ice Planet is... an ice planet. Probably a subdivision of Futuron performing science on an ice planet. For being the coolest dudes, they don't have much "lore" but their emblem does resemble an icy Futuron emblem. Unitron is a PMC that can protect your interests without asking as many questions as the Space Police... for a price. Roboforce is a PMC that can protect your colony or perform search and rescue, also for a price. Most recently, the Explorien corporation has arrived to investigate newly uncovered alien artifacts. This will eventually lead them into conflict with the Zotaxians (aliens from the UFO sets, who are vicious conquerors) or into contact with the Holoxians (aliens from the Insectoids sets, who are refugees from the Zotaxians.) If Rock Raiders fit, they'll be another, smaller-scale mining interest, perhaps a crew of freelancers. So now that I've exceeded my autism quota, what are your thoughts? Should I put more work into this? Do you have anything to suggest/add/change? O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)02:49:52 No.67744945 >>67744810 >>67744816 >>67744824 Other Space themes around that era include the Earth-based Space Port, Life on Mars, and Mars Mission. I don't feel strongly about including them in the "canon" but if I did they'd happen back in the Sol system in the pre-Futuron era, perhaps illustrating humanity's first attempts at interplanetary colonization and the subsequent discover of (an as-yet undefined method of) FTL travel. Life on Mars is about encountering peaceful Martians and Mars Mission is about a conflict with evil CrystAliens, so my thought is the Astronauts would stumble into this conflict, maybe re-awakening the very last surviving Martians and helping them defend against the CrystAliens... But since they don't share much in common with the pre-2000 era sets, visually OR thematically, that might just be a lore easter egg. Similarly, things like the Aquanauts are sci-fi underwater s--- but they come with Earth sharks and octopi, so l'd be inclined to keep them on Earth. Maybe throw Exo-Force in there too. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)03:57:59 No.67745451 File: Bricks_n_Pieces_Summer 19(...).jpg (185 KB, 792x1117) >>67745270 Look at the art in the OP, and imagine the entire Lego SpaceVerse reimagined through that lens. Basically I'm treating it as a backdrop for a general scifi setting, which is to say that people are still flesh and blood and not made out of bricks. The "seriousness" I'd put somewhere around classic film serials and comics of the 1970s, or kids adventure cartoons from the 70s-90s. Futuron being a sort of morally ambiguous megacorp version of Star Trek's Federation. Which is to say, the setting takes itself seriously - but the content is closer to PG than R. That's really just my take on it, though. I'm claiming no ownership over this, and if you want to throw out your own ideas of "Grimdark Legoverse" or "Super Campy Extra Fun Block Space" I would absolutely encourage you to do that! >>67745217 Sure. Rule of thumb: If it's one of the Lego sets, it's in the universe (somewhere.) I haven't decided if I want this (pic related) lore from the old set catalogues to be canon or not, but generally it looks like Spyrius uses a lot of big robots and employs armies of smaller androids in their ranks. Perhaps they're part of a top-secret robotics project from the old Blacktron? Hmm, experimental rogue Al (and their human servants/employees/partners) could have been the incident that got Blacktron exposed in the first place.. but that runs the risk of making everything too inter-connected. Thoughts? O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)04:08:30 No.67745527 >67745451 honestly the whole concept of Spyrius (A place that's more or less a planet of criminals and spies existing without getting orbitially bombarded by the space police on the daily) is kind of silly in the first place, so I say take the complexity as far as you want. I can definitely see an antagonistic relationship between Spyrius and Blacktron going on though. Assuming Futron still has a major stock in the Space Police business, Spyrius would probably be paying some hefty bribes to keep the police from raiding them. (If that didn't make much sense forgive me I'm tired as s--- right now) O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)04:14:45 No.67745572 >>67744810 I seriously doubt I will be able to convince my group to do this, but it definitely piques my autism. I like that the setting is so vast, but the technology is at a 90's futurism level, rather than sci-fi magic. It appeals to me a lot more than 40wank or cybershit. It's funny that some obscure LEGO flavor text captures such an interesting space setting. My only concern is a lack of content, unless you were willing to break from the "lore" to make your own, which sort of takes away from the feeling that you're playing LEGOS with dice. For instance, what are the established planets/colonies in this setting? Aside from Spyrius and Ice Planet, are there any other named planets or stations? I really like that you can just play with LEGO figures and blocks instead of traditional miniatures and terrain. It makes it cheap and easy, as well as allowing for a much larger variety of scenarios as well as keeping the childish feel of playing with LEGOS. Feel free to dump more of the sets that are inspiring you. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)04:18:51 No.67745608 >>67745451 >>67745527 >>67745571 Could also be one of those situations where everyone "knows" Spyrius are a bunch of spies and villains but on the surface they deny everything and are really good at making it impossible to actually prove, and no one will f--- with them openly because they have a giant army of robots and androids. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)04:35:21 No.67745736 >>67745608 That was mostly the direction I was taking with Blacktron as the shady rival corp (neutral evil pretending to be true neutral), with Spyrius being more along the lines of the unambiguous "villains". I think Spyrius would be more defended by their robot army. People know they're bad but can't really catch them, and the magazine excerpts suggest they have spies everywhere. situation of their home base being hidden or inaccessible, and heavily >>67745549 Exactly this >>67745572 Actual, hard setting details I could definitely use some help fleshing out. There are a few things we can borrow; example, Spyrius was marketed as coming from a planet by the same name. Ice Planet was said to have taken place on a planet called Krysto-2002. Some of the sets have names, like Zenon Star Base. But the specifics of mapping the colonies isn't something I've tackled yet, or how the geopolitics or economy functions (outside of basic "megacorps and colonies" and "mining s---") I'm thinking the colonies exist in a small star cluster, where travel between planets takes hours and travel between stars takes days, but travel outside the colonies would take weeks, months, or years (to keep the setting relatively contained.) I don't know what form FTL travel should take though. As for content l'm approaching it from kind of a Star Wars angle; the "stuff" we see (in this case, lego sets) is indicative of the bigger world but only scratches the surface. So rather than there only being one Deep Freeze Defender operating as Ice Planet's mothership, there would be dozens, hundreds, or thousands of ships of that class. There'd be plenty of room to introduce new designs, or fill in the gaps between them (ie there are a bunch of starbase sets, but none of them have bunkrooms... so one would have to assume there are living habitats connected to them) It's past my bedtime so l'm probably gonna take a step back for now, but I eagerly encourage anyone to throw around ideas of their own! O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)13:45:59 No.67750971 File: explorienfossil.jpg (40 KB, 352x211) >>67746768 >>67746783 >>67746792 >>67746808 >>67746813 >>67746824 >>67746837 This is all incredible. Do you happen to have any of the writing saved from that thread? I'd love to revive/cannibalize anything else they were working on. >>67744824 >Most recently, the Explorien corporation has arrived to investigate newly uncovered alien artifacts. This will eventually lead them into conflict with the Zotaxians (aliens from the UFO sets, who are vicious conquerors) or into contact with the Holoxians (aliens from the Insectoids sets, who are refugees from the Zotaxians.) So their whole thing was "decoding" these Alien fossils. I only have the vaguest concept for what's so special about them. Maybe they fill the role of the generic precursor race? In any case they seem like an easy segue into the UFO sets as extragalactic invaders, the "big threat" lurking in the darkness. Old Lego lore has the UFO aliens and the Insectoids aliens coming from the same planet so currently I'm preserving that by having the latter be refugees on the run from the former. Our boys the Exploriens will probably be the ones who stumble upon whatever ANCIENT SECRET it is that draws the UFO guys into our little corner of the galaxy. >>67745939 I thought so too but it's not as many as I thought. Rock Raiders were after Energy Crystals, the Aquazone factions were after Hydrolator Crystals, and the Insectoids had their Voltstones. RoboForce had these weird 1x2 chips with a circuitry design that said "ROBO" on them (that they collected in their storage boxes) but I don't know what those were supposed to represent. Robobux? Anyway, there's a lot of gaps that could be filled, like WHY the different guys do what they do. Ice Planet stuff has a lot of rockets, and they're supposed to be testing satellites or something? Why do that on an ice planet? The big orange chainsaws are probably to cut through ice, but... if they're testing satellites, why are they cutting through ice? O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)13:51:42 No.67751066 File: Ufo_alien_black.jpg (109 KB, 920x690) >another art dump while l'm typing You guys are great >>67750971 (cont'd) Maybe there's something fucky with the ice planet's magnetic field (naturally occurring, or hidden alien macguffins under the surface) but that's all l've got right now. If anyone wants to help flesh out some of the factions, go wild! And Re:Exploriens, their gear was always identified as like... telescopes and sensors and s---, even though they look like big ol' lasers. I might treat them as being kind of Star Trek inspired where their gear is INTENDED for exploration, but nothing's stopping them from shunting tachyons into the chrono- resonator firing beams tiparticles or the f--- they gotta do if attacked. They're the "weird faction. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)14:32:23 No.67751651 What if the orange transparent pieces are hard light? some sort of deployable chip that allows mass production/infinite use of necessary items? using the OP Image, the dude has a chainblade for ice clearing, skis, and a protective visor/HUD. Blacktron survived primarily on the recreation of Fultron quality level Lightchips using what they had managed to take with them after their speration from Fultron. This was blatantly done, but as Fultron developed farther and farther ahead in terms of quality and technical design, Fultron developed a near identical Lightchips system, giving off red light rather than orange. While there is no meaningful performance difference between the two, an individual's color hue is often all one needs to know about their personality. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)14:42:48 No.67751792 >>67751651 some other thoughts that occured after posting >Hardlight tech is what allowed Fultron to defeat the economic challenge of mass supplying budding colonies? >Crystals mined >>67750971 are uniquely vital as refractory elements in making Hardlight. The rights to mine are held in a fragile compact between Fultron and M:Tron, alongside the RockRaider subsidiary tasked with asteroid mining. >Freelance Casters (Hardlight designer) operate amongst all factions, leading to most non aligned players within the intercorp Cold War being a piecemeal of various Lightchip ensembles >Hard Light being opposed by some other type of equally useful and cost effective tech, either by alien forces or another corp. I like my idea a lot obviously, but I think it is at the very least a good handwave to keep the spirit of the camp and 80's aesthetic of the transparent orange, neon green, and other color schemes in the sets O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)16:44:04 No.67753628 >>67751651 >>67751792 I'm of two minds about hardlight. On the one hand, it's a killer idea. Solid flavor and explains the translucent aesthetic. On the other hand, having it be easily toggleable kind of undermines a few things. I was hoping to preserve some hard sci-fi aesthetic, since everyone wears space suits and it seems like climate-controlled habitats are minimal. So it can't be a miracle technology that solves every problem. Also the sets themselves, the "hard light" pieces are on hinges and s--- (if they move) and I want to keep the setting closely inspired by the sets. But I have some workarounds... One, maybe those cockpits aren't MADE of hardlight, but are reinforced by it? So a scaffolding or a sheathe of regular sci-fi glass is supporting a reinforcing hardlight structure. Second, maybe Hardlight is persistent; you don't switch it on or off like a flashlight, you forge it in a factory. It's light weight and versatile and maybe still needs to be "plugged in" to a lightchip to stay coherent over time, but that would explain why, say, the ice planeteers have a rack on their snowmobiles to hang their hardlight skis rather than just switching them off. Maybe both? O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)16:53:33 No.67753770 >>67753628 The orange transparent gear kind of looks like the omniblade from Mass Effect 3, which was a melee weapon made from hardened omnigel (a technobabble material used for just about anything). Basically, when you needed the blade, you'd essentilly instantly 3D-print one, and while it would break after use you could generate a new one as long as you have a supply of omnigel. O Anonymous 08/10/19(Sat)19:19:31 No.67756196 >>67753628 >One, maybe those cockpits aren't MADE of hardlight, but are reinforced by it? So a scaffolding or a sheathe of regular sci-fi glass is supporting a reinforcing hardlight structure. Second, maybe Hardlight is persistent; you don't switch it on or off like a flashlight, you forge it in a factory. It's light weight and versatile and maybe still needs to be "plugged in" to a lightchip to stay coherent over time, but that would explain why, say, the ice planeteers have a rack on their snowmobiles to hang their hardlight skis rather than just switching them off. Maybe both? Sounds like the miracle material Stuhr from The Leeshore by Robert Reed. >Stuhr is superstrong to the point of being usable for things like space elevator cables or the walls of fusion reactors, but only as long as it has a slight electrical current running through it. Turn that off, it disintegrates into dust. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)04:40:06 No.67763673 >>67753628 >>67756196 I like this thing of a super strong material that needs to be constantly powered or else disintegrate. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)11:01:21 No.67767321 File: Fundemental building bloc(...).jpg (78 KB, 744x389) >>67746598 Jump gates would work quite well - you can fly about in your "local" space under your own power, but the only fast, safe way to travel long distance is to go through the gate. Of course, there are risks - the Gates work by breaking down what goes through them into their smallest components, then reassembling them on the other side. Sometimes it can take a very long time before a jumper to come back, and sometimes they come back... different. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)12:34:48 No.67768539 File: 6704_Space_Explorers.jpg (62 KB, 412x271) >>67753770 >>67756196 >>67763673 >>67766981 Yeah, I definitely like HL as a concept but I think it needs to have some degree of permanence. I think having it switch on/off and/or being easily malleable, Green Lantern style, diverts away too much from the classic idea. I want to keep a version of it, though, so l'll post more about it shortly >>67767321 I like this. I like the subtle shoutout to being blocks. I think l'd make some handwave caveat that they only "mis-build" inorganic material, because the body horror of being rebuilt without your legs is darker than I was going for, but the very real risk of having your ship rebuilt missing a key component is perfect. Also, the Zotaxians (UFO) are said to come to "this galaxy" through a wormhole... so I'm gonna kitbash some lore about this. In fact... maybe Humans can't transport living material at all? I'll present two options in my momentary loredump. I really appreciate the help and the enthusiasm, everyone! O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:26:11 No.67770312 File: 1-45.jpg (84 KB, 400x400) >>67768539 Re: Hardlight Hardlight is a lightweight, resilient, and versatile glass-like material formed from coherent energy. It is the handwavium "miracle" material that is at the center of the science that makes the colonization of deep space possible. The early Futuron expeditions only possessed rudimentary hardlight technology (peep the Classic Space sets) but resources from the star cluster and advancements in technology have turned it into a part of everyday life. The fabrication of hardlight used to be a proprietary technology which only Futuron knew how to do, but the secrets of its manufacturer leaked after Blacktron was excised from the company. This in turn broke some of Futuron's hold on the colonies, as where once they had a monopoly on the sole piece of technology running the system, now other corporations have the opportunity to move in and rock the boat. But just because anybody can build hardlight, not everybody has the resources to do so, and not everybody can do it well. It takes large factories, powered by energy crystals, to create the base material. Futuron is still the top dog in the sector, and that's not likely to change. Hardlight itself energized. Separate a hardlight structure from its energy source and it will slowly weaken over the course of hours or days, shatter, and eventually dissipate back into pure light as the containment field destabilizes. This is why we can see hardlight tools being used without a power source or interface, but rarely see entire structures made of the material. (Editor's note: I like the idea of them being "loose bricks" instead of something that can be switched on and off) (1/5) semi-persistent. In its raw form, it is a malleable, viscous substance with little rigidity. It requires the application of... science beams... (A light quench?) to harden it into a persistent structure. Once "forged" and "quenched", Hardlight objects keep their shape as long as they remain O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:27:14 No.67770324 File: 6929_Box.jpg (257 KB, 868x533) >>67770312 (2/5) Hardlight can be repaired by re-energizing it with an energy beam the way one might use a welding torch to repair metal, able to consistently return to its full strength. It can be recycled and reshaped to form different structures, and while this is often less expensive than forging brand new structures, it requires time and special equipment and thus isn't possible to do in the field. Scavengers will often scour wreckage for still-coherent hardlight pieces, rushing to gather them before they dissipate, so they can resell them to hardlight reclaimers. This is the corporations try to discourage, because they can't tax it. practice that Re: Space travel Warp drives work by doing some science s--- with hardlight. Propulsion still happens neighboring star system. Travel back to inhabited Earth space takes decades. "real" space, but due to science fuckery still allows ships to reach faster-than-light speeds in open space. However, space is vast, and even the fastest warp ships can take several days to reach the closest Futuron created the first Jumpgate (Buildgate?) out of Earthspace. It operates much like >>67767321 suggests; by deconstructing an object into "pieces," beaming them through [brickspace], and reconstructing the object at the destination. This process is not infallible, but it cuts the travel time to the nearest inhabited star sector from decades down to months. The sole jumpgate in the colonies is run, of course, by Futuron, but they do license its use out to other corporations (and heavily tax it). If a corporation were to build another jumpgate, it could cause a massive paradigm shift in the balance of power. (Editor's note: I want to keep Earth and other inhabited space a distant thought, to keep the setting grounded in the colonies. Leaving the colonies and escaping the corporations is outside most people's means.) O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:28:57 No.67770353 File: Mm001.jpg (45 KB, 240x320) >>67770324 (3/5) *I'm thinking that gates can't transport living material at all, and are thus far only able to transport tools, supplies, and communications. The initial colonists only arrived via warp-powered sleeper ships, and now that they're here, there's no way to leave (or come back) without making another decades-long trek through empty space. New colony ships arrive every so often, but until the problem of shipping organics through buildgates is solved, for most people it becomes a one-way trip. Maybe just cut the warp travel down to a few years and gate travel to days/weeks... Idk. Re: Al Service robots are somewhat common. (If you look at the sets, there are quite a few that come with non-minifig robots.) Heuristic, adaptable, learning Androids are not. Spyrius was the first to crack the problem of a "smart" droid, and for years they were the only ones. There are even some rumors that they are lead by one such droid. The Explorien Corporation has recently rolled out their own model of highly advanced smart droid for use in their expeditions, though, and nobody else is quite sure how they managed to do it. (Editor: Spyrius and Exploriens were the only human sets to have android minifigs) Re: Aliens Humanity made first contact with extraterrestrial life over a century ago on their Mars colony. While much of that information has been classified (read: I cba), this is what is known: Martians were peaceful, technologically advanced, but dying. After establishing communication and sharing knowledge (such as the early secrets of Hardlight tech), the CRYSTALIENS ATTACKED. Crystaliens were a race of hard, translucent crystal beings that were just really, really rude. They waged war with Earth and the remnants of Martian civilization to settle an old grudge (some believe they were an artificial race created by the Martians themselves, made of actual living hardlight). In the end, Earth won, but both the Martians and Crystaliens were wiped out (.. or were they?) O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:30:12 No.67770377 File: Lego_Insectoids_Catalog.jpg (193 KB, 800x398) >>67770353 (4/5) What Earth learned from the conflict allowed Futuron to become the prevailing megacorp, and opened up the possibility of interstellar travel and eventually the construction of the first buildgate. MEANWHILE, IN ANOTHER GALAXY.. The aliens of Zotaxia waged a bloody civil war. The Zotaxians are another race of persistent, hardlight-based life forms with highly advanced technology. Being hardlight-based, they can travel through "buildspace" unhindered. A large faction of refugees from this civil war fled their home galaxy, and ended up in ours, building a new home beneath the surface of the planet Holoxia. Holoxia, on the surface, is a barren and rocky world... but underneath the crust are layers and layers of caverns surrounding an "inner sun". These caves maintain an ecosystem dominated by massive, hardlight-and-silicon- based insects (dubbed bilgen bugs). The Zotaxian refugees (now calling themselves Holoxians, subtly changed by the planet's energies) were forced to adapt to this new environment by repurposing their vehicles to mimic the forms of the bilgen bugs in order to traverse the subsurface world of Holoxia unmolested. Their vehicles are powered by Voltstones, energy crystals able to recharge themselves in the rays of the inner sun, designed to look like bilgenbug eggs so they may be placed and "charged" in the bug's nests unnoticed. The life of a Holoxian is tough and unforgiving, but it is a life free from their former oppressors. Or it has been, for the past several generations. But the Zotaxian military has never given up the search for their former enemies, and their General has recently arrived from their home galaxy to find them and bring them back under Zotaxian rule. (Zotaxians = UFO sets, Holoxians = Insectoids sets). It's only a matter of time before the General finds them.... or the colonies. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:31:56 No.67770401 File: 6979.jpg (201 KB, 874x626) >>67770377 (5/5) The colonies are unaware of this, and of ANY extraterrestrial life for that matter. After the Mars conflicts, Humanity has not made first contact with any new civilizations. Recently, though, the Explorien Corporation has arrived in-system studying what appear to be strange alien fossils. The Exploriens seem more interested in peaceful exploration, but do they have a hidden motive? Their technology appears to be more advanced than that of Futuron and the other Corps. What's their real story? How did they break the secret of smart androids? And what's the story with these fossils? What aren't they telling? Those are things I figure are better as plot hooks, but I think in general terms: The fossils are of an older race (Perhaps Zotaxians? Perhaps precursors?) that are themselves a hardlight-silicon-based life. Studying the fossils are what broke the code of creating smart androids and unlocking new secrets to hardlight, and that's why the Exploriens are so good at it. Also, I think Spyrius was able to kitbash their droids together years ago this same way - perhaps after discovering and rebuilding wrecked Zotaxian/Insectoid techdroids. And perhaps that's why they're able to pump out robots like nobody's business. That's what I've got so far. As usual, comments, critiques, suggestions, etc. are all welcome; I consider this a community project more than "mine" and I wouldn't have come up with half of this if you guys hadn't shown up. Next I think l'll work on fleshing out individual factions, so get those ideas out there! Also, all terminology is pending... things like build gates etc are mostly placeholders O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:46:28 No.67770642 File: 6958_Android_Base.jpg (189 KB, 800x574) >>67770401 Miscellaneous s---: I should add, l'm envisioning the "colonies" being a collection of maybe a dozen stars, surrounding the central build gate (which is the most densely populated, and the seat of Futuron's strength). Further outward expansion is hindered only by supply lines to and from the build gate; uninhabited star systems aren't inaccessible, they're just further away. Planet Spyrius sits hidden at the "edge" of what is currently colonized. Holoxia is outside the colonies, but close enough that someone like the Exploriens could discover them. The Zotaxians are searching for them, and are likely to start a conflict with anybody else they encounter. Any conflict would inevitably spill into the colonies. But these are the "looming, mysterious threats" rather than the clear and present danger. Explorien Corp might have secret Crystaliens in captivity. Futuron might have secret Martians kept alive back home. Spyrius might be lead by a droid, and that droid might be a an ancient and malfunctioning/repaired Zotaxian (or Holoxian, or "unnamed precursor") techdroid. It might be pulling a Skynet- style long con against the colonies. Or none of these things are true, they're just some potential plot hooks. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)16:56:57 No.67773015 The part about interstellar travel being relatively slow (minimum of months, if not years or decades) the stargates only being able to transport inorganic matter would explain how Spyrius is a thing. The planet could be located at the edges of explored space, making sending a force to wipe them out very difficult due to the sheer travel time involved. Possibly the exact location of the planet isn't even known. However, since inorganic matter can pass though gates without issues, the Spyrians could have contructed their own gate and use and use it to transport their androids. Since they're way ahead of most other factions in Al development (possibly due to finding some precursor technology on Spyrius), this gives them a major advantage. Aside from the obviously robotic androids, they probably also have ones designed to pass off as humans, which they use for espionage. The androids could infiltrate other organizations, steal data, and use the jump gates to escape back to their base without being able to be followed by the Space Police. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)18:01:29 No.67774053 File: Interceptron Transformer.jpg (3.08 MB, 3507x2478) Ok, here we go This is the Spyrius Interceptron Droid, a roughly man sized infiltration-focussed droid with two modes. The first mode, traveling mode, takes the form of a miniature, 2 meter long spaceship. It's as fast as a standard spaceship and, due to being purely mechanical, can evade being discovered by bioscanners. It is designed to be a stealth spaceship mode, though newer radars can pick them up. hand-waved as the central navigation module). After traveling to its destination it can switch to humanoid mode to more easily navigate inside spaces. This mode is less agile and subtle than androids who possess just a humanoid mode, but the travel form allowing for quicker attacks and less chance to be discovered upon entry . If seen by the naked eye it is often mistaken for a normal sized spaceship and therefore expected to be farther away and not posing direct danger. (The cockpit being there doesn't make much sense other than to give it a Transformers look. It could be either ignored or be makes up for it. Humanoid form possess standard android intellect and multiple hacking and information-extraction programs and tools, as well as a self-destruction protocol, should the mission be a failure. Interceptrons can use weapons in this mode, but rarely come outfitted with them, due to already being clunky for an espionage android and being focussed on staying undiscovered anyway. I've always really like the angle of Spyrius being specialized in robots and androids and a shapechanging infiltration android just made sense to me. Also it fits quite well with the idea of Jumpgates only being able to transport non-biological matter, so Spyrius , as a sort of guerrilla spy group, had to resort to creating artificial minions to bolster their ranks quickly. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)18:02:35 No.67774080 File: Spyrius tank1.jpg (775 KB, 1836x2199) Secondly, the Spyrius Tremor Tank. I imagine Spyrius having multiple hidden bases on and inside meteors and asteroids. There (and on Spyrius itself) these tanks can be found. They only ever get used in missions in the rarest of cases, mostly just being stored in the hangars of their bases. But in case of an all-out raid on the base itself these tanks, with the help of some airborne defenders, can keep the attackers at bay long enough for the crew inside the base to delete all sensitive information, flee the base and cover their tracks. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)18:03:40 No.67774095 File: Spyrius tank3.jpg (1.89 MB, 3264x2448) Once the base is cleared of all crew and information, the cockpits of the tanks detach from their bases, the communication gear swings forward (improving the location and navigation functions) and the barrels swing back, becoming propulsion units. When the cockpit has shifted to escape-configuration, it gets sent encrypted space-locations of the course of the escape vessel with the rest of the crew and travels there. These escape pods reach extremely high speeds, but they can only travel for very short distances. I've always like the modular capabilities of many classic Lego sets and in a universe, where it is much easier to send inorganic material than crew members it seems logical most ships would have some sort of escape pod and in colonies there would be a very clear philosophy to accept material losses if it means there's a higher chance of lives being saved. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)18:04:53 No.67774114 File: Ice Planet WIP.jpg (1.28 MB, 2663x2142) Lastly I have this very rough wip of an Ice Planet utility vehicle, because they are really lacking in that department. For the finished version the lower part would be much bigger in relation to the cockpit. I imagine this vehicle being accompanied by some other vehicle made for cutting ice blocks out of mountains and pic related then picking up those pieces and transporting them either to a research station (should they contain some sort of precious mineral or other interesting objects) or just dumping them somewhere. The combination of those vehicles would allow for quick tunnel building or maybe even excavating spaces for bases built into ice mountains. Also the resulting ice blocks could be used to build structures as well. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)18:11:51 No.67774257 File: Desertron pics.png (2.04 MB, 1454x1088) Oh also this my silly OC faction „Desertron" Just a small crew that stranded on a planet mostly comprised of a barren desert and in search of water, which they carry in rounded canisters and use both for themselves and as fuel for their machines (No idea why they wouldn't use solar energy, it doesn't make sense at all). Also one crew member swears he saw insect like humanoid silhouettes in the distance, but surely that's just the heat... This doesn't really fit in any big canon, but it might be a neat plot hook for some small rescue mission adventure or just background fluff that never gets followed up on. I like the idea of there being a bunch of small independent spaceship crews, hoping to make a fortune by exploring planets ignored or not yet reached by the bigger corporations. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:58:02 No.67770832 >>67770377 Weren't the Insectoids all humanoid with heavy cybernetic modification? O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)15:12:30 No.67771098 File: lego-ufo-alien-blue-minif(...).jpg (116 KB, 700x700) >>67770939 >>67770984 >>67771002 As opposed to >>67751066 and pic related. I'd actually make the Insectoids/Holoxians a completely separate "race" from the Zotaxians, maybe rather than escaping a civil war on their homeworld they're two species that shared the same system and the Zotaxians conquered them, and just have weird alien mentality where they don't take too kindly to the Holoxians "escaping" their empire. Or something. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)16:02:55 No.67771996 >>67771098 The "original lore" called the UFO aliens Zotaxians, and ALSO called the Insectoid aliens Zotaxians that were "on the run from their evil leader". The two themes were not released concurrently, though, so it could have just been a recycled name. I took the opportunity to expand on it, expanding on the "on the run" bit... But I also forgot they were opaque. So let's switch it up. They're either another "caste", or a race that was subjugated. Maybe even the UFO Zotaxians are a construct race that took over, machine uprising style? O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)16:10:01 No.67772135 >>67771996 What if the Zotaxians weren't always cyborgs or hardlight and were once an organic species, but were once a single race that had to adapt to a drastic change to their home world, and one faction did so by becoming cybernetic, and the other by putting their consciousness into hardlight constructs? This could also be the source of the civil war (similar to Total Annihilation, one of the best RTSS of the 90s) O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)14:27:49 No.67770335 File: 6155-1[1].jpg (141 KB, 871x599) LEo SYSIEM What if I wanna have underwater adventures? O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)16:34:00 No.67772601 File: 6198-1.jpg (206 KB, 872x624) >>67770335 Perhaps the initial push for space colonisaiton came about because Earth suffered a catastrophic environmental collapse, complete with massive sea level rises. A few hardy souls remained on earth, eventually making use of the technological advances in power generation, hardlight and sealed environments to begin reclaiming the planet. In turn, the developments in deep sea habitats and diving vessels have allowed new colonies to be formed offworld on aquatic worlds which were formerly uninhabitable. Alongside the "official" underwater colonies, pirate raiders, scavengers and other, weirder factions have developed. O Anonymous 08/11/19(Sun)23:49:47 No.67779015 >>67770335 >>67772601 I like the idea of Hydronauts and Scorpions being divergent factions of the original Aquanaut explorers and colonizers, and the Aquashark dissidents who chaffed under the rule of their corporate transportation sponsors and the subsequent contracts of indentured labor. Over time ideological and philosophical divisions grew greater, until the discovery of energy crystals in deep ocean trenches (Later discovered to be a subterranean phenomenon that was pushed upwards as a result of plate tectonics. Developments in deep-earth mining technologies resulted in the establishment of the Rock Raiders, who came to public consciousness after the disappearance of one of their flagship vessels, the LMS Explorer, which to this day is one of the most famous unsolved mysteries of space exploration) ignited their animosity into full-blown conflict. On one side were the more technologically advanced, corporate-sponsored Hydronauts, who used liquid-breathing technology to enable abyssal-trench exploitation. Opposing them were the Stingrays, who engaged in full-blown genetic alteration to free themselves of their reliance on expensive off-world manufactured goods, the cost of which often resulted in divers taking on further debt before they had even repaid their initial transportation contract. O Anonymous 08/14/19(Wed)05:36:03 No.67817953 >>67744810 I'm gonna use this as a rough basis and expand it to include all the non-licensed space themes. Thanks OP. O Anonymous 08/14/19(Wed)08:26:46 No.67819272 >>67744810 What about the medieval sets ? O Anonymous 08/14/19(Wed)12:27:29 No.67822196 >>67819272 They are far too removed from this and would work better as their own world. O Whiteagle 08/14/19(Wed)14:56:37 No.67824226 File: 37058628275_1a453b2e97_o.jpg (1.9 MB, 2275x2945) >>67822196 >they are far too removed from this and would work better as their own world. As in literally their own entire World, bootstrapped by stranded Spacers into a Techno-Fantasy land! O Anonymous 08/15/19(Thu)09:06:48 No.67836529 >>67744810 This post reminded me of the insane canon I had for all my LEGO sets back in the day. I think I set the whole story on Ice-Planet but I needed an explanation as to why they never left so Ice Planet was actually a giant planet the size of a solar system with several small stars orbiting it for light(I was a kid so forgive my scientific ignorance) and there were "Gravity Sinks" where all the gravity of the planet was concentrated leaving only regular earth normal gravity everywhere else. The Ice Planet people were a faction who were able to survive long periods in the ice, everyone else was trying to stay alive by going really fast or building giant ships to stay warm, the robot-heads(my autistic brother ate almost all of the heads of my early LEGO mini-figs so I stuck various parts on them to make them robots) were a faction allied with the Ice Planet characters. Blacktron and Spyrius(who had a few specific robot-minifigs who were evil) were the bad guys and the Robots(big non-minifig robots I made from some random Technic sets) were against everyone. The Space Police were good guys stranded on the planet trying to establish law and order but needed the Ice Planet factions resources to survive. The Exploriens could actually escape the planets gravity but stayed looking for alien tech that everyone was after. There was a bounty hunter I had who was an early Space Police mini-fig I got years after Space Police was upgraded, he hated one of the Insect-people and some other character I can't remember but he was also evil and had a weird face under his mask. I took a lot of inspiration from He-Man as I recall. I played in that world nearly every day for about five-six years and l'd forgotten all about it, never even wrote it down. It's nice to go back to a place like that even if only for a few minutes, thanks Anon. LEGOLAND](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/list/002/276/011/905.png "Lego Space Setting Worldbuilding (part two)")
Moar:
![O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:16 No.22071714 Fun Statistics: A steam rocket powered by a Decanter of Endless Water and heated to the operating temperatures of most steam engines would produce 27 kN of thrust, an exhaust velocity of 1450 m/s, and a specific impulse of infinity. A single Decanter would be able to lift anything less than a ton into space. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:30 No.22071894 >>22071714 And that is my Artificer's next project. What temperatures do most steam engines usually operate at? I kind of doubt that the Cauldron of Brewing would achieve it? http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/c-d/cauldron-of-brewing >Hot enough to boil salt water. Let's assume that salt water is the highest concentration of sodium chloride soluble by water, or Brine. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:36 No.22071951 >>22071894 Those were pretty sketchy calculations at the time I did them, and I have no real faith in the accuracy of that thrust number. Here's the math I used: http://www.braeunig.us/space/propuls.htm http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/airplane/rktthsum.html Can't figure out what number I used for the heat of a steam boiler, but apparently the most a standard industrial-revolution steam boiler could withstand was 250 psi, so the temperature should be calculatable with the Ideal Gas Law. (If you make the vessel out of adamantine or riverrine or mithril or something, then there should be no real pressure limit.) O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:40 No.22071981 File: 1355686835928.gif-(3 KB, 250x390, Rocket Thrust Image 01.gif) >>22071951 Alright, so the law for thrust of a rocket engine is F= qVe + (Pe- Pa) * Ae Where q is the mass flow, Ve is their ejection speed, Pe is the pressure of the exhaust gasses, Ae is the area of exit, and Pa is the pressure of the ambient atmosphere. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:46 No.22072033 >>22071981 Now, we'll assume that this Decanter is on full blast, and we'll assume that the rocket is built in such a way that pressure inside the chamber is constant, so we know that the mass flow g is 18.93 kg/s O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:48 No.22072046 >>22072033 Furthermore, we will use that steam-engine figure given earlier and assume that Pc is equal to 250 psi, or 1.721 megaPascals. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)14:57 No.22072138 >>22072123 It's the nozzle factors that are really killing me. I'm not a rocketry expert, and l'm having trouble figuring out what nozzle design I should assume- because, obviously, propellant/oxidizer mix isn't a factor, nozzle designs are really the only important factor. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:09 No.22072249 >>22072046 Ah! Found a superheated- steam table. If pressure is 1.721 MPa, then the temperature will be about 200 degrees C. So that gives us Tc as well. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:10 No.22072264 >>22072249 And the Specific Heat Ratio of steam is 1.33. That gives me what I need to figure out the idea nozzle factors. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:13 No.22072293 Doesn't the rocket still need fuel to turn the endless water into steam? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:14 No.22072303 >>22072293 Cauldron of brewing bro. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:14 No.22072311 >>22072303 Or a flaming weapon. Or a portal to the Elemental Plane of Fire. D&D Magic gives no s---- about conservation of mass/energy. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:21 No.22072400 >>22072264 Alright, so rounding to 1.7 MPa of chamber pressure and 200 degrees C of chamber temperature... at the throat of the nozzle, the pressure is about 1 MPa and the temperature is about 172 degrees C. Almost to the point where I can work out the thrust. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:25 No.22072443 >>22072400 Okay, so now to work out the ideal area of the nozzle. The molecular weight of steam is 18.02, and the area of the nozzle throat is given by > At = (q / Pt) x SQRT[ (R' × Tt) / (M × k) ] O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:32 No.22072516 >>22072443 So, the area of the throat for the optimal nozzle for this configuration is about At = (19/1000000)*SQRT((8314 * 450)( 18*1.33) or 0.0075 square meters. Just a few equations to crunch and we'll have the thrust. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:35 No.22072559 >>22072516 The hot gases must now be expanded in the diverging section of the nozzle to obtain maximum thrust. The Mach number at the nozzle exit is given by Nm^2 = (2/ (k - 1)) × [(Pc/ Pa)^((k-1)/k) - 1] Do we want to calculate how well this engine will perform in SPESS, or at sea level? Pa is the ambient pressure, so l need to know what numbers we want. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:39 No.22072624 >>22072559 Could we take the integral from space (0 Pa) to 1 atm (101,325 Pa)? Well, sea level is good enough; since that's where we'd take off from, O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)15:43 No.22072662 >>22072559 Calculate for both, it shouldn't be a big problem. Kerbal space program: Eberron edition. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:02 No.22072976 >>22072867 Alright, so the first variable in the thrust equation we haven't figured out is exhaust velocity, Ve. >Ve = SQRT[ (2 × k / (k - 1)) × (R' × Tc / M) × (1 - (Pe / Pc)^((k-1)/k))] k is, again, 1.33, R' is 8,134, Tc is the chamber temperature, so about 470 Kelvin, M is the molecular weight of steam, so about 18, Pe is equal to Pa (assuming maximum efficiency), so that's about 0.1 MPa, Pc is the chamber pressure, so about 1.7 MPa... O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:15 No.22073198 >>22072976 Alright, so exhaust velocity equals 1110. Next, finally, the thrust! F = q x Ve + (Pe - Pa) x Ae q is the mass flow, so (asuming steam or water isn't building up in the boiler) that's equal to the amount of water coming out of the decanter - about 19 kg/s. Ve, which I just worked out (assuming I didn't screw anything up), is 1,110 m/s. Pa and Pe are the same, assuming maximum efficiency, so they cancel out and I guess I didn't even need to work out exit area at all, goddamnit, because it's being multiplied by zero. In that case, assuming I didn't screw anything up, the thrust of a Decanter rocket is q * Ve, or 1110 m/s times 19 kg/s. So that's about... (drumroll please).. Twenty-one kilonewtons. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:21 No.22073282 >>22073198 Alright, so. What does this mean we can get into orbit? Assuming your fantasy setting is taking place on a spherical planet pretty much similar to our own, and assuming you're launching pretty close to the Equator, and assuming your day is 24 hours, you need about 10 km/s of Delta-V to get into orbit. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:30 No.22073443 >>22073198 So it gives us 1:1 thrust to lift ratio for a rocket that weights 2tonnes? And it only gets better the higher we get? And we don't need to pack this s--- with fuel but we can basically pack 2 tonnes of cargo into this s---? 20 people and some stuff to keep them alive up there? I'm sure NASA would love it. Not to mention you can strap on more decanters without big change to rocket's mass. S---'s insane. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:31 No.22073444 >>22073282 However, because calculating delta-v requires taking the log of the wet mass/dry mass, and since there's no difference between wet mass and dry mass, this is pretty much useless. However, because we can burn literally forever without running out of fuel, then what this means is that as long as we can lift it off the launchpad, we can get it into orbit. Thus, anything weighing less than 21 kN can be put into any orbit we want, as long as we're willing to wait a bit. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:36 No.22073525 >>22073443 Oh, it gets even better. Three words: Bag. Of. Holding. By abusing extradimensional spaces, we carry all of our cargo in bags of holding. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:37 No.22073546 >>22073444 >>22073525 So placing these into an artificed vessel that had endure elements on it marked up to +30 spell levels, and then with the proper supplies, and contingency spells, 300 decanters of water could theoretically propel a 300 ton self contained atmospheric, false gravity supplied biodome into space. With that in mind, that would be a f--- awesome setting. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:37 No.22073547 >>22073525 Fill the bag of holding to maximum capacity from the decanter of endless water. Open the bag at the same time you open the decanter. 21kN is for babies. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:38 No.22073552 Okay. How much will this spaceship cost, and at what level will a party be able to buy and make one? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:41 No.22073596 >>22073525 So, the rocket's got 21 kN of thrust, right? And it needs to be accelerating at about 10 m/s upwards to actually get off the ground, so it can only weigh about 2100 kg. Now, let's assume 10% of that is taken up by structural s---, rockety stuff, all that jazz. That means we can carry 1890 kilograms worth of cargo. A single Type IV bag of holding weighs 27.2 kg, so a single Decanter can carry a bit less than a maximum 70 bags of holding. In other words, by filling our cargo with Bags of Holding, the rocket can actually carry FIFTY-TWO TONS of cargo in the bags. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:43 No.22073627 >>22073552 Alrighty. A Decanter costs about 9000 gp. How much does a flaming weapon or portal to the Elemental Plane of Fire cost? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:44 No.22073637 >>22073627 >portal to the Elemental Plane of Fire What, you mean like a Gate? Going off the 3.5e PHB (or was it the DM's Guide?), getting a wizard to cast a level 9 spell for you is certainly going to cost more than 9,000 gp. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:44 No.22073642 >>22073627 Moderate evocation; CL 10th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor and flame blade, flame strike, or fireball; Price +1 bonus. So to place that onto a weapon, roughly around 2000 gold. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:47 No.22073692 >>22073642 We have no idea how hot that burns, so let's say we need five of those to get it this hot for a nice round ten thousand. How much would the mundane ironworking for the pressure vessel cost, do you think? We're currently at 19000 gold for the magical components of a single Decanter engine. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:44 No.22073638 >>22073596 In other words, by spending a fuckton on Bags of Holding, the ship can actually have twice the payload capacity of the Space Shuttle. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:51 No.22073742 All right, now let's assume this is a standard structure we are pushing into orbit, and to survive the hazardous ascent, it needs to be able to withstand exit and re-entry of the atmosphere. How would this be approached, and what would it's final weight, cost, and volume be for life support/storage. We will assume that using magic dickery, that a trick to supply artificial gravity has been supplied and implemented. >>22073692 That's just for one thermopile class heater though. In my opinion, it would be much easier to use a ramped up version of Heat metal and then use a metal sheath for the decanter, and then monitor the heat using a cold junction to the sheath and wire running to the inside from the outside to make a Thermocouple, and then use a magical circuit to display what it's temperature is to monitor it's efficiency and therefore prevent engine damage. S---, that's another issue, the decanter can still be destroyed. How will we shield out heating element from the outside as well? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:55 No.22073819 >>22073742 >Hazardous ascent Here's the thing: Thanks to our literally infinite supply of thrust, we don't actually have to go up at any normal acceleration. For most of the time in-atmosphere, our ascent could very well take place at practically walking pace. As long as we're willing to sacrifice the time it takes to wait for this thing to fully accelerate, it can be as sedate as it needs to be as long as it can acquire sideways acceleration while overcoming gravity. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:52 No.22073763 >>22073547 It's too bad you can't place Bags of Holding full of endless water inside Bags of Holding. That output would be... yeah, I'm not even going to pretend to know. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:55 No.22073825 >>22073742 I should also state I know that thermopile would be the wrong term in this statement, but it's the nearest thing I can think of to put this into comparison for myself. >>22073765 I'm not sure if that offers protection in degrees, or just + to saves. I know if we used crystal as a heat shield, it should last long enough but that would shatter too easily. Ceramic exists in d and d, right? >>22073763 You COULD however, rig that up to use Mercury. OH S---. For that matter, using artifice, would it be possible to make a Decanter of endless Mercury? F--- 21kV. 1SG IS FOR P------. Mind you, druids would throw a S--- FIT, but... O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)16:57 No.22073856 >>22073819 Well, that's pretty damn awesome, but with how the Decanter works, wouldn't be efficient unless you made it not work on stages, but on a 0-100% scale, and as far as I know, there is no way to control a decanter in that manner. If you COULD though, HOW would you do it? Verbally? Could you rig up a circuit that could electronically control it? 4-20mA? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:00 No.22073904 >>22073856 Valve. Keep it on Geyser all the time, and control how much water goes to the boiler and how much is destroyed or vented or teleported or shoved back into the Elemental Plane of Water or something by varying how open the valve is. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:09 No.22074076 >>22073904 Good idea. Turn the decanter instead from an engine into the supply, and then Throttle with a valve. That can be controlled with analog, if not simply by hand inside the vessel. Better part of that is, if we go about the design right, multiple valves can be used to create a high grade exhaust, and then shielding the elements is no longer an issue, just making sure the piping for this design is able to withstand the pressure the decanters will be supplying, and then if it can handle shifts in velocity. F---, should I start drawing a PID of this? /tg/, are we really making a spelljammer without making a spelljammer? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:10 No.22074087 >>22073742 Here's what you'd need for life support: >Bottle of Air- the bottle is always completely full of fresh air. With a pump, you could pressurize the entire capsule from one. Costs 7,250 gp and weighs 2 Ibs. >Some way to temperature-control the capsule (any ideas?) >Bag of Holding full of food (2,500 gp, 15 lb) >Pipe going to the Decanter to provide endless fresh water on demand There. Everything you need to live for quite a while, for about 10000 gp. If you want enough food to last forever, splurge on a Sustaining Spoon (enough gruel for four people, forever- 5400 gp). O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:11 No.22074111 >>22074076 So far we've determined that for the magical component of the engine and for life support, you need 29000 gp. How much will we need for the hull, navigation instruments, and the various engine plumbing? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:13 No.22074142 >>22074030 I must admit, I laughed. Also, bottle of air. When it space it would become a perfect engine. In fact it isn't said if it has any limits on how much air it can produce - so in vacuum it would be a problem to make it LESS effective to not kill the crew with acceleration. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:13 No.22074149 >>22074087 Isn't there an item that simplifies all that? A Ring of Sustenance or somesuch? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:16 No.22074202 >>22074087 A hero's feast table or a table enchanted with create food would also work. But not a pipe from the decanter. We don't want to offer any sort way that an engine failure will f--- over the survival of the adventurers. A separate tank with another decanter would work fine. >>22074111 Engine plumbing cost depends all on the metal used. Adamantine would be what I would recommend, but that would be almost impossible to get in the quantity that would be required. Elven steel might work, Dwarven crafted Dark iron definitely would. Artificing the pipes to withstand heavy and sudden changed of pressure and temperature. Navigation would rely on divination magic. No need to complicate this with mechanical instruments when Divining position is accurate, and easy to come by. The hull is still in question. Using Rope trick to form individual rooms, and suppying those rooms as living quarters/storage would simplify things tremendously. They couldn't have water piped to them, but with an item that creates water on demand, cheapens that up as well. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:18 No.22074225 >>22074202 I based the engine calculations off of the pressures and temperatures of a mundane locomotive boiler. We will probably not need any especially fancy metals. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:18 No.22074230 If we make the pipes out of Mithril or Adamantium, they could survive any kind of pressure we put it through without breaking, but that would increase the cost by a lot. That said, if we had some high end dwarf forged steel it should be able to survive this. Also, isn't their an item that costs very little gold but has a permanent endure the elements(which lets you be okay in incredibly hot or cold environments) that would allow you to be in space without dying from cold? Or we could just have a heatsink setup to the steam pipes that could bring warmth back to the cockpit. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:18 No.22074241 O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:20 No.22074267 >>22074230 Warming the cockpit isn't a problem. The issue with space is /cooling/ the cockpit. >>22074241 I'll look in the ultimate srd for glacial spells. I know there's on in there that focuses on climate control. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:23 No.22074311 >>22074241 Boom. Chill Metal Transmutation (Cold] Level: Drd 2 Components: V, S, DF Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Target: Duration: 7 rounds Saving Throw: Will negates (object) Spell Resistance: Yes (object) equipment of one creature per two levels, no two which can be more than ft. apart; or 25 lb. of metal/level, none of more than 30 ft. away from any the rest can Chill metal makes metal extremely cold. Unattended, nonmagical metal gets no saving throw. Magical metal is allowed a saving throw against the spell. An item in a creature's possession uses the creature's saving throw bonus unless its own is higher. A creature takes cold damage if its equipment is chilled. It takes full damage if its armor is affected or if it is holding, touching, wearing, or carrying metal weighing one-fifth of its weight. The creature takes minimum damage (1 point or 2 points; see the table) if it's not wearing metal armor and the metal that it's carrying weighs less than one-fifth of its weight. On the first round of the spell, the metal becomes chilly and uncomfortable to touch but deals no damage. The same effect also occurs on the last round of the spell's duration. During the second (and also the next-to-last) round, icy coldness causes pain and damage. In the third, fourth, and fifth rounds, the metal is freezing cold, causing more damage, as shown on the table below. Round Metal Temperature Damage 1 Cold None 2 lcy 1d4 points 3-5 Freezing 2d4 points 6 lcy 1d4 points 7 Cold None Any heat intense enough to damage the creature negates cold damage from the spell (and vice versa) on a point-for-point basis. Underwater, chill metal deals no damage, but ice immediately forms around the affected metal, making it more buoyant. Chill metal counters and dispels heat metal. There's a Ivl 2 spell that would easily do it. It's ambient and not direct, though. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:22 No.22074294 Please tell me someone's archived this thread. The Greyhawk Air and Space Administration cannot be forgotten. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:21 No.22074281 >>22074199 Does anybody have the character wealth/level table? I want to figure out how feasible building this s--- is. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:23 No.22074317 >>22074281 PC Level* Wealth 21,000 gp 33,000 gp 4 6,000 gp 5 10,500 gp 6 16.000 gp 7 23,500 gp 8 33,000 gp 9 46,000 gp 10 62,000 11 82,000 gp 12 108,000 gp 13 140,000 gp 14 185,000 gp 15 240,000 gp 16 315,000 gp 17 410,000 gp 18 530,000 gp 19 685,000 gp 20 880,000 gp O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:23 No.22074319 What about really long voyages? Would it be cheaper to use Suspended Animation, or would a system involving timed release of Flesh to Stone and Stone to Flesh potions be superior? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:26 No.22074365 >>22074317 So so far, everything we've calculated is well within the reach of a single Level 9 PC, or an adventuring party of four Level 6 PCs. If your party pooled its funds, you guys could f--- off into space by Level 6. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:29 No.22074410 >>22074365 If the group had a master as well, it raises the cost, but also raises the masterwork bonus. A quality ship would be about level 13 for a single PC, or a group of 4 Ivl 9's. The time would take would be roughly around a few months to complete. assuming all party members do nothing but work on the ship as a craft check. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:42 No.22074626 This is so perfect for my campaign, Itg/, you have no idea. I'm anticipating my party f------ off into the stars soon (getting into orbit won't be an issue for them because the spacefaring Dorfs are paying them to quell a slave riot that's been delaying the reconstruction of the moon). I've got a few ideas for crazy places they'll end up, the most developed of which is a shipwreck planet inhabited by rednecks. Every year they have a coming-of-age ritual in which young rednecks try to cobble together semi-spaceworthy Spelljammers out of the remains of the many derelict ships on the surface of the planet, and then race. In that spirit, what are some delightfully ghetto ways to make space travel even cheaper, with no regards to safety? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:46 No.22074692 CURRENT PARTS LIST FOR s.S. SPESSWIZARD: Engine: (may use more than one) >Decanter of Endless Water (9000 gp) >Five or so flaming items (10000 gp) >Elven-steel tank and nozzle >Valve and a way to get rid of excess water for thrust control >Gimbals for thrust vectoring Cost of magical components: 19000 per engine Cost of material components: ? Crew Area: >At least one Bottle of Air (7250 gp) >Air Pump >Rope Trick rooms >Rings of Sustenance: 1/crew member (2500 gp) >Rod of Heat Metal and Rod of Cool Metal Structural: >Elven-steel airtight hull >Feather Fall spell for re-entry Navigation: >A good telescope and maybe a golem. Speaking as a KSP player, some way to calculate velocity would also be really nice. >Assorted gubbins for engine control O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:48 No.22074749 >>22074626 F--- life support; go for Protection from Elements and huffing out of a Bottle of Air. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:50 No.22074780 >>22074749 Is there a DC for environmental hazards from space? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:53 No.22074819 >>22074780 Cold beyond extreme? Absolute zero? That's in a book somewhere, I'm sure. Constant exposure to radiation? Random space debris hitting you at extremely high velocities? Not sure about those. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:54 No.22074831 >>22074819 Unsurprisingly, 4e is not a treasure trove for matters like this. I'll see if I can rig up something from 3.x. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:55 No.22074842 >>22074819 The real issue isn't cold. Space is an insulator; you will cool down if you're in it and emitting no temperature, but it'll take a while. Your real issue is overheating- direct, unfiltered sunlight is brutal, and you'll slowly overheat just from your body's waste heat. Vacuum's an insulator. Mostly you've got to worry about suffocation, low pressure, and heat damage. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:57 No.22074879 >>22074819 Space isn't actually cold, it has no temperature. The vacuum does other bad s--- to you though. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:57 No.22074884 >>22074842 >>22074842 >>22074842 Of those, which should even have Fortitude saves, and which should just deal direct damage? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:52 No.22074817 >>22074692 Fun Fact: At the highest weight which still allowed it to take off from Earth, the ship could reach Alpha Centauri in just 3.5 years shiptime (accounting for time dilation.) O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)17:57 No.22074873 So, /tg./ We've successfully designed a goddamn spacecraft which is within the limits of a heroic-tier party's wealth. My question: What do we call it? I propose the TGS Super Soaker. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:00 No.22074937 O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:01 No.22074950 >>22074873 TGS? >>22074937 TeeGee Ship. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:05 No.22075007 O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:06 No.22075022 >>22074988 Well, what would you suggest? The Gygax-Class SPACE WIZARDS? >>22074873 Grognard-class spaceship. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:19 No.22075181 >>22071894 Why not use an radiator to pump heated medium into the vaporisation chamber, the heat of which is supplied by a fire elemental at the other end of the radiator? With enough surface area, proper valve timing, and a large enough elemental you could cause ambient vaporisation in the main chamber as the propellant passes through, creating a high-pressure steam rocket with infinite operating time. O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:36 No.22075360 >>22073525 Or hook it up to a portal at station control, with a big enough portal you can move anything into orbit from a tiny rocket O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:48 No.22075550 >>22075407 The real question is: How do we arm ourselves? O Anonymous 12/16/12(Sun)18:51 No.22075595 >>22075550 "Photon Torpedoes" - Wands of Magic Missile "Phasers" - Disintegrate. For ship-to-ground weapons, bring along a Bag of Holding full of something heavy and heat-resistant. Dump them out of the bag while in orbit. Bingo, 250 Ibs of kinetic death. File: 1352174471636.jpg-(1.62 MB, 1600x900, City 341.jpg) O Has anybody seen this kind of thing somewhere? Anonymous 11/05/12(Mon)23:01 No.21451889 You know what's a genre I haven't seen before? Hard science fantasy. Sort of a combination of your typical heavy-magic 3.5 setting and a hard-science one. Instead of spelljamming and crystal spheres, vast rockets powered by Decanters of Endless Water and fire-elemental steam boilers bridge the trillion-mile gulf between stars, while the crew lies frozen in Stone to Flesh suspended animation. Huge space elevators built of iron trusses and guy wires stretch to low orbit, carefully distributing all of the crushing load onto thousands of specially placed Immovable Rods. Archmage Galileo Galilei invents the telescope, and immediately uses it for line-of-sight teleportation to the Moon. The world is threatened by terrible weapons powered not by nuclear fission, but by placing linked Rings of Teleport in a vaccuum and letting an object fall until it reaches relativistic velocities. Sort of like Dungeonpunk-meets-Heinlein.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/masonry/002/027/783/ccd.png "Decanter of Endless Water Spaceship")
![O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)22:44:57 No.77258684 E >>77258795 >>77258841 >>77258846 >>77259110 >>77259185 >>77259502 >>77259512 >>77259542 >>77259547 >>77259604 >>77259675 >>77260073 >>77260098 >>77260138 >>77260167 >>77260179 >>77260305 >>77260306 >>77260343 >>77260523 >>77260555 >>77260641 >>77261441 >>77261856 >>77262808 >>77263036 >>77263262 >>77263387 >>77263425 >>77263450 >>77263495 >>77263534 >>77263918 >>77264075 >>77264864 >77265016 >>77265085 >>77265305 >>77265493 >>77267292 >>77267403 >>77267456 >>77268464 >>77269193 >>77270017 >>77270076 >>77270136 >>77270167 >>77270251 >>77270255 >>77270944 >>77270994 >>77271661 >>77271751 >77272038 >>77272096 >>77272227 >>77275864 >>77279260 >>77279328 >>77279673 >>77279829 >>77280713 >>77281875 >After reading your character's future, the seer tells them this: "It is your destiny to become the greatest enemy of the light that this world shall ever see. Never shall there even be a villain who can compare to you." How does your character react to this? Hard Mode: Provided that you accept that this is your character's destiny, how would they go about fulfilling this prophecy? O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:20:56 No.77259085 >>77259142 >>77259465 Oh boy, prophecies, those always go over wellI. I guess first order of business is to kill the seer so she doesn't go telling everyone that they should try and stop me. After that, just keep doing what I was doing, I guess. Either she's wrong, and I shouldn't worry, or she's right, and fate will figure it out. O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:25:55 No.77259142 >>77259201 >>77259213 >>77259465 >>77259085 >I guess first order of business is to kill the seer Sounds like something a great and terrible villain would do upon hearing this prophesy. O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:31:22 No.77259213 ► >>77259142 Lol this. So, SO many prophecies come to pass when the villain tries to stop it from happening. Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:51:14 No.77259465 ► >>77259085 >>77259142 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdqnvxiHu_Oc [Remove] The Prophecy Hotline Watch later Share DON'T O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:30:13 No.77259201 >>77269881 >>77259142 It's just pragmatic. If this chick goes around saying l'll become a great evil, do you know how many scores of Paladins will kick down my door? Better to keep her quiet, permanently O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)15:57:01 No.77269881 >>77259201 Yeah unless somebody starts investigating the Seer's death and finds out what her very last prophecy was. And now, you've got EVERYONE on your ass; because they think you're up to something and killed the only witness. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)00:43:51 No.77260167 >>77263316 >»77267587 File: Mikhailos, the redeemed p(...).jpg (58 KB, 704x824) >>77258684 (OP) "So be it then. If I cannot be a beacon of hope for this world, then I shall be a hammer that tempers its virtue. I shall perform such acts of villany that heroes will have no choice but to rise against me. I shall be the one against whom the light's mettle will be tested. The world will find unity either against me, or under me." O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)00:57:21 No.77260305 ► >>77261652 File: Spoiler Image (74 KB, 1300x737) >>77258684 (OP) I will accept this terrible purpose. I shall become the obstacle humanity needs to overcome to reach its ultimate potential. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)03:54:08 No.77261652 ► >>77260305 Could it be? Is... is that... WATER!? AHHHH I'M DECOMPOSING! DON'T SAVE ME SIONA O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)00:57:33 No.77260306 ► File: 3AF6C1F2-1926-4A54-B331-2(..).gif (2.95 MB, 500x500) >>77258684 (OP) Great, If my fate is to become a villain then I will strike a deal with fate. I WILL NOT do anything bad until I'm a king with a harem. Because it is my fate to be a villain, this must happen. Upon fate granting my wishes, I wll fulfill my end of the deal. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)08:03:19 No.77263387 ► >>77258684 (OP) Set about my ambition to take over the world assured that I can beat the competition. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)09:07:18 No.77263918 ► >>77264156 >>77258684 (OP) Question: Is the seer always right or is it some s----- carnie-bunkum? O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)09:25:44 No.77264156 >>77263918 Traditionally it's a self-fulfilling prophecy brought on by trying to avoid it. So, malarkey, but very advanced. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)11:14:06 No.77265598 ► File: 1592547389859.jpg (72 KB, 520x664) My character is a believer in the absolute and unavoidable fate. That is, like, her entire thing. So her reaction will be >Well s---, gotta begin kicking puppies. I don't want to, but the stars will punish me if I disobey, and l'll end up doing it anyway. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)14:13:47 No.77268361 File: A9271C21B1F950F853086E570(..).jpg (19 KB, 637x358) *Smiles* Well then lets you and me get this party started. Oh yes you heard right. You keep on staring into that crystal ball of yours and give me a heads up on what's too come. In return you'll be a made ma- er lady. You want a palace? I know just the place to build one. Servants? There's a town not far from here I'm sure we can talk them into working for you. Boys? Girls? I can rustle you up some fine specimens. Whaddaya say? We have a deal? I can sweeten some more if like. O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:49:05 No.77259435 >>77259447 >>77259562 >>77271703 OK. So, what do you say to the offer of becoming my totalitarian empire's second in command? According to you, I've got the potential to become an absolute dictator. Considering my present position in life, I doubt this is plausible without my having a serious Outside Context Problem as an advantage over the rest of the world. That's where you and your ability to predict the future come in. http://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/visionsofabetterworld >The decision was made. Foundation researchers finally received permission to conduct a large-scale system of exposure to SCP-028. Dozens of people would be sent through the empty storage yard every day and thoroughly interviewed and, if need be, interrogated to determine what they had learned. Every scrap of information would be recorded, analyzed and, if deemed sufficiently valuable, released to the general public. >The first month alone resulted in designs for a cold-fusion plant that could power a city the size of London indefinitely, the composition of a fertilizer that would break down harmlessly in seawater and the name of the designer of SCP-914. The Foundation, through its numerous fronts, was rapidly able to improve the quality of life of almost every human on Earth, providing the world with the technologies and knowledge it needed to become a better place. >Then James Harrison Reuben walked through the yard. >James Harrison Reuben was a cable repairman from Topeka, Kansas. A blue-collar worker in a simple, menial job. A perfect receptacle for knowledge. We sent him in with visions of new advancements and beautiful new technologies dancing through our heads. >He came out with the knowledge of how to conquer the world. O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:50:07 No.77259447 >>77259562 >>77271703 >>77259435 >It's been seven years since then. His armies and death squads march through the streets of every city in the world. Every battle is a devastating victory: how can it be otherwise, when he has perfect knowledge of all our battle plans before they even happen? It is only a matter of time before he overruns our final stronghold. >l'm sending this message out through our wide-band radio transmitter on the off chance that someone will get this message. I'm doing this because the last transmission of our intelligence operatives, before they went dark, shows that Reuben is building space ships. Hundreds of them, lined up in ranks stretching across the Florida coastline. >But I can't shake the feeling that maybe this is all part of his plan as well... O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)14:20:55 No.77268464 ► File: the_grand_magus_by_oneste(.).jpg (170 KB, 1280x1888) >>77258684 (OP) I seek out a place where a great evil or injustice is occurring, and in a moment where I might intervene and prevent it - I stand by and do nothing. In doing so, I fulfil the prophecy, making it a broader metaphor about the evils of inaction. There is no greater enemy of light than the apathetic fool who who allows evil to prosper and succeed. With this done, I avoid a more literal interpretation of the prophecy, and the resulting life of infamy, torment, and inevitable destruction at the hands of the forces of light. O Anonymous 01/30/21(Sat)23:53:04 No.77259502 ► >>77258684 (OP) He'd probably immediately assume corruption in the 'light' and kick off a purge. O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)16:18:09 No.77270255 File: 1806_by_morkardfc_dccr8db-pre.jpg (45 KB, 827x967) >>77258684 (OP) if you are a virtuous man and the world becomes opposed to you, it is the world that is wrong being a cleric means never having to question that clearly this world is destined to fall into such depravity that even "light" becomes a vile thing and by God I am all that stands between the world and that hateful destiny O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)15:09:28 No.77269193 >>77258684 (OP) Take it literally, get put on house arrest at a rural agricultural property with a large dwelling, and then operate a particle accelerator to make some low mass, short lifespan black holes. Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)16:13:45 No.77270167 ► >77270203 >>77258684 (OP) I decide to leave the world at large, get lost in some massive forest or jungle and live out the rest of my life as a hermit O Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)16:15:26 No.77270203 >>77270289 >>77270167 An accident while making a fire lights the forest on fire. An extended period of drought and poor management has left the forest ripe for fire, and within a month nearly a continent of woodland and grassland has been burned away. You did this. You ruined the world. GG O Anonymous 02/01/21(Mon)05:48:17 No.77280160 ► "Oi wots this c--- sayin'? Oi'll neveh turn on ingerland and the queen'?" Anonymous 01/31/21(Sun)18:25:34 No.77272227 > >>77258684 (OP) I start going after every light source I can. I blow every candle, shatter every lantern, douse every fire and smother every torch. Long as I live, no light shall shine upon the land.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/002/016/348/a8e.png "the seer tells you your future is to become an evil overlord")
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