Forums / Discussion / General

Yo, can I request a lock? there's really no point in this thread continuing any further

fuck, the page get again?

"Female nipples are illegal"? Are you sure the admin wasn't just fucking with you, pooch?

¯\(ツ)/¯
The exact quote was "the site has to play by the laws of the land, which is still unfortunately scared of lady nips"

Oh okay.

Well I think that's clearly speaking figuratively, his point being that advertisers and such don't like female nudity, which is the same thing that everyone else in this thread has been saying.

Sanakan_ht wrote:

Then there, that's the answer from an Admin. Case closed. That's all folks. Let's go home.

OP made this thread to critique the site's policies and therefore, implicitly, the policies of the admins. I don't see how an admin reiterating their position changes anything.

Also, while it's true that no major policy changes can occur without the admins, the mods have a lot of discretion around the edges that's worth fleshing out.

---

I haven't thoroughly read every post but it seems like nobody's mentioned the fact that KYM already permits female nipples under some circumstances. For instance, in cartoonish illustrated form with CountryLove. There's long been the policy that nudity and depictions of nudity are permitted as long as it's indispensable to documenting a meme.

Suppose we compare CountryLove to the entry that Pooch linked in his OP. Can someone justify what appears to be a discrepancy in content policy?

Is it because illustrated nipples are inherently less pornographic or sexually titillating than real nipples? Nobody should believe that on KYM where it seems like everyone jerks it to 2D women. Plus CountryLove actually depicts a sexual act, whereas OP's meme is literally just an unglamorous image of a nipple.

Pooch said:
"I agree with getting rid of random lewds. I hate the trending images are filled with random portrait shots of random characters. A new rule that images must be meme related and not just random fanart would be nice."

Basically, if I'm interpreting correctly, what he wants is for the site to tolerate nudity as long as it's exclusively for the purpose of meme documentation.

That's an entirely reasonable position, and what's more-- it's already the case. It just isn't enforced consistently or coherently, because nobody's really discussed it before.

I'd argue the picture of the nipple itself isn't needed to understand the meme, or the meme derivatives that spawn in response to the original tweet. CountryLove's entire meme is the picture itself, and any meme derivatives spawned from CountryLove follow the same pose and trace over it.

The meme that is spread around in "Twitch Scammers Tried to Bribe Me" is the actual texts of the tweet, turned into a Copy-pasta. It's the same as how some copy-pastas have highly obscene contents in their texts, but you can't censor it because that is the part of the meme that is spread. The nipple picture itself could be replaced with anything, and it still works.

In fact, looking at the Gallery, it seems that is exactly what has happened. The only one with a female nipple is the Original Tweet. Every other meme image that makes this a meme, has no nipple.

Ergo, no need for the Female Nipple in the Original Tweet, only the Copy-Pasta Text.

Perhaps it is a bit tangential to the subject at hand, but as I seem to recall, there is a sort of "art clause" in the rules for nudity. Art is pretty subjective, and I will confess that I've been somewhat curious as to just how far one could push that rule and have it still be considered defensible. (Adherence to other rules and relevance to certain memes assumed)

For example, if I uploaded a bunch of still images from the opening of Elfen Lied to the anime gallery, it would be art, not sexual, and relevant to the gallery. It would also be mostly nudes. How would that go over?

You make a valid point, but only under the interpretation of the nudity rule that I gave, where images are allowed if they're "indispensible". I'm not saying my interpretation is the correct one--earlier tonight a mod summarized the rule as "nudity is allowed when its sole purpose is meme documentation", in which case the nipple image clearly qualifies in terms of allowing the KYM entry to present a complete and self-contained summary of the meme. One of the problems with this discussion is that this rule is so ambiguously worded, enforced (e.g. in terms of the CountryLove uploads), and justified, and it's been interpreted loosely and in several variations by mods since it was first drafted into the rules years ago.

A productive discussion would be where the line is drawn and why it's drawn there. I feel like a lot of users in this thread have been chasing a red herring (is that the right term?) seemingly arguing for "continuing" a total prohibition of female nipples when such a thing never really existed.

P.S. I'm currently coming down off an acid trip, it's a Herculean effort just to string two thoughts together lol!

---

@Nox Lucis

I'd be willing to defend such uploads on the combined bases of art exemption plus meme documentation, provided that the anime got its own entry. I wouldn't do it on the former alone since I don't think KYM should be encouraging random media uploads that don't contribute directly to an entry, but that's just me.

Basically, if I'm interpreting correctly, what he wants is for the site to tolerate nudity as long as it's exclusively for the purpose of meme documentation.

Since that KYM tolerates nudity on only CountryLove and Piccolo Daily Dose due to meme documentation. Then if I remember correctly, Nier Automata on the Butthole images should have stayed for meme documentation. But it was removed later on when I checked it recently.
-
Yes, I know, it shows an anus, a covered anus, not tits. Then again I would say the same thing to CountryLove since it shows vaginas.
-
Edit: Holy fuck the NSFW version of Piccolo's Daily Dose is removed. It's now 404'd

@poochyena
>I'm an advertiser
Oh lord this made me laugh. So how much dd you pay for advertising your rinkydink fur crap? Id love to know. Now all jokes aside, have you ever been diagnosed with any kind of disorder Pooch? This might help me understand your brand of denseness. I don't want to be punching too low.

So then if I were to upload those still images and/or link the opening in the video gallery, even though it is representative of an iconic piece of mature anime media it would still be considered "not cool" on the grounds that specifically documenting Elfen Lied and Lilium is nonessential to documenting the meme relevance of anime in a broader scope?

Well, there's no sin in uploading just the audio, and I see we don't already have that so I'm going to go do that now if I can find an still extant YouTube upload with clear sound.

Edit: Oh wait. You just edited. Lemme read that first.

Edit Edit: Gotcha. Elfen Lied is certainly notorious and influential, but it has more of a history as the subject of memes rather than a meme in and of itself. Giving it its own entry seems a bit dubious.

EditEditEdit: (Best upload has nude "barbie doll anatomy" fan art in the thumbnail so I'm linking with NSFW tag. No nipply, no removey, m'kay?)

Sanakan_ht wrote:

Nier Automata on the Butthole images should have stayed for meme documentation. But it was removed later on when I checked it recently.

Uh, could you elaborate? Does the meme have its own entry? I think that's probably a prerequisite for any of the meme's assorted NSFW images to be considered vital to documenting said meme.

---

@Nox Lucis

If you're right that the anime is "notorious and influential" and the subject of memes, then an entry could probably be justified. It would certainly be keeping in line with the admins' expanded mandate for KYM.

Like I said, I think a strong case could be made for permitting the opening stills in that case, especially if it can be demonstrated that the opening sequence has been influential or the subject of a lot of internet buzz, which it seems like it has. Though I anticipate some or most other mods would disagree, and I don't know about the admins.

---

I'm going to sleep, I'll (maybe) pick this up again later.

Uh, could you elaborate?

Waddya mean? I literally remember in the Nier gallery that there are NSFW images of a covered anus of 2B. But I'm not sure it was done by an Admin or a Mod. I'm sure the removal was done by a Mod though.
The External Links even leads to the 2B butthole.

Does the meme have its own entry? I think that's probably a prerequisite for any of the meme's assorted NSFW images to be considered vital to documenting said meme.

Oh now it needs a SEPERATE ENTRY to do that? Last time the NSFW rules says this:

Images, videos, forum posts and comments that do not fall within the NC classification but are vital to the documentation and meet any of the following criteria must be properly labeled as not safe for work (NSFW) when uploading, including external links in the Notes section.

Of course it says "vital to documentation" but nowhere does it says it needs a separate entry to do that. I'm honestly confused.

"Since that KYM tolerates nudity on only CountryLove and Piccolo Daily Dose"
Sad news: don blocked the daily dose image

Put me in the screencap.

There are a couple of posts in this thread that have been made with the intent of mocking Poochyena's lifestyle, personality or habits rather than dealing with the topic at hand.

Keep it civil.

Dopesmoker wrote:

Sad news: don blocked the daily dose image

Then what's the point of having nudity for meme documentation if an Admin hides it. I'm gonna guess that Don was forced to do it due to the advertisers being a thorn on his neck or the original artist copyrighted it.

Mare is completely on point with what i've been trying to say.

@Tubo Qjoft
>how much dd you pay for advertising your rinkydink fur crap?
I spend about $150 a year on average.

@Eglamore
I don't mind as long as they aren't personal attacks

@Sanakan_ht
Daily dose was a little more than just nudity.

@poochyena
>how much dd you pay for advertising your niftywifty furry carp?
I spend about $150 a year on average.

Well I could me wrong man, but I don't think that's enough to warrant the risk of losing advertisers. I can't vouch for what other adverts pay. I'd like to see you hit a middle ground in this conversation kiddo, it just gave me a headache reading through this. I apologies for being too rough on ya in a conversation Im not part of.
All I can says is I agree with ya on the female diddy shouldn't be looked down on as smut, but until the change is the norm… this conversations pointless.

Are you reffering to some of us being annoyed with poocyena for never accepting that evidence shows he’s wrong?

I totally understand you being annoyed with that. It's indeed very annoying.

But that isn't what I said, nor what I was referring to.

To be clear, I am specifically talking about insulting posts which have made comments like "do you have a disorder?" Now I don't care if Poochy has a thick skin or can handle that; I know full well he doesn't give a fuck and can take a bit of banter. But there are nonetheless standards of behaviour and conduct to maintain and all of you will maintain them or the thread will be locked and suspensions and warnings handed out.

Although I am pleased to see Tubo has already apologised over his previous post, so I'm content to consider the matter resolved at this point.

@Eglamore
Sorry about that boss, I should have worded it better. I was legitimately wondering of Pooch has any kind of disorder not as an insult, but to help understand his situation.
One of my closest palls finally told me one year that he has high functioning autism, it helped piece together all the misunderstandings we had over the years & concepts he had a hard time grasping. If Pooch does and don't want to share with the class, I ain't gonna blame em.

>I was legitimately wondering of Pooch has any kind of disorder

I don't. I just have a lot of free time and enjoy politics.

@poochyena
>I don't. I just have a lot of free time and enjoy politics.
Ah, fair enough.

Thank you for clarifying

can we get an F in the chat for our fallen hero

F

F Daily Dose, gone but never forgotten.

Good to see Daily Dose was brought up btw, because that one properly reflects the issue that comes with site growth:

History has shown KYM's view on NSFW/NC stuff can be kinda dynamic at times. Our scope of documentation broadens, however on the other side things we used to allow are no longer allowed.

From what I can see it's that the internet has become more prude. Well, not necessarily the users, but the guys who go over the greens. A great example is what we saw happening to Tumblr and recently the smaller Pikabu.

So to bring this back to the OP post:

There is no law against showing women's bare chest on the internet. Its not against advertiser's rules. There is no explanation for it other than sexism by the owners and admins of this website.
Men and women should be treated equally on this site. Either censor all nipples or no one's.

Big boys like Twitter, Reddit and Tumblr are already powerless against adapting to social norms. So what is a smaller site like KYM even expected to do here? KYM is not here to be the fucking visionaires on titty nipples. KYM has two functions: Document internet phenomena and rack up enough boolah to get the staff their bread on the table.

Is the taboo on female breasts sexist? Maybe, I'm not gonna go into that topic because I consider it a different topic. The taboo over female breasts is not a KYM issue but a social issue. This thread is about allowing them on KYM, which is in general impossible as long as society considers it a big no.

---

But that one has already been brought up, so let's change the focus a bit:

I haven't thoroughly read every post but it seems like nobody's mentioned the fact that KYM already permits female nipples under some circumstances. For instance, in cartoonish illustrated form with CountryLove. There's long been the policy that nudity and depictions of nudity are permitted as long as it's indispensable to documenting a meme.
Suppose we compare CountryLove to the entry that Pooch linked in his OP. Can someone justify what appears to be a discrepancy in content policy?
Is it because illustrated nipples are inherently less pornographic or sexually titillating than real nipples? Nobody should believe that on KYM where it seems like everyone jerks it to 2D women. Plus CountryLove actually depicts a sexual act, whereas OP's meme is literally just an unglamorous image of a nipple.

Generally from what I noticed it depens on if the lewd parts need to be visible for the meme to function properly? This is a yes in the case of Countrylove and no in the case of the Twitter titty. Countrylove is an edit, while the OP entry is mainly about the reactions.

Two examples which reflect this as well are ME!ME!ME! and the Spiderman Ass Slap. ME!ME!ME! allowed for the original video to be posted since the meme is about the entire video, while with the Spiderman slap only the slapping scenes were relevant to the meme and not the entire 20 minute porn vid.

But here is the most notable inconsistency:

You know how the porny entries have their ads disabled? I did a double check and it seems currently all NSFW pages have their ads disabled. I never noticed this until now and I assume the same for other mods. I don't think we were informed of this either. I'm interested in getting informed about what's up here as well.

Which funnily enough makes Pooch's point actually sorta valid: What is the point of censoring a booby if it's the source of the meme and NSFW entries already have their ads removed by default?

Men and women should be treated equally on this site. Either censor all nipples or no one's.

To quote the ancient memes: "TITS OR GTFO". It appears KYM chose the latter.

---

Waddya mean? I literally remember in the Nier gallery that there are NSFW images of a covered anus of 2B. But I'm not sure it was done by an Admin or a Mod. I'm sure the removal was done by a Mod though.
The External Links even leads to the 2B butthole.

2B's butt was sorta a big event at the even following 1) people actually buying into 2B having her butthole visible in the game and 2) the creator asking people just send him all the 2B butt art they could find.

There is already enough hentai on this website. Not going to lie I like to see tits, buuuuuut this is not a porn site. (It might as well be thou. :/ )

@RandomMan
>Big boys like Twitter, Reddit and Tumblr are already powerless against adapting to social norms. So what is a smaller site like KYM even expected to do here?

but… twitter and reddit already allow female nipples.

>as long as society considers it a big no.

What exactly do you mean by "society" though? Everyone keeps using that word, but not defining what it means exactly. The kym society? American society? Western society? worldwide society? The only group that I know that are terrified by female breasts are extremely religious jews, christians, and muslims. Considering most kym users are non-religious i'm going to guess most don't get offended by boobs.

@MemeMasterDerp

I agree that less porn on this site is better, but that has nothing to do with this topic.

@RM

1) people actually buying into 2B having her butthole visible in the game and 2) the creator asking people just send him all the 2B butt art they could find.

Then name it a hoax then so people would not buy it? Plus, Yoko Taro is just being Yoko Taro, just a couple weeks ago he becomes a VR Youtuber like Kizuna A.I. for a single day. Japan is weird yo.

Big boys like Twitter, Reddit and Tumblr are already powerless against adapting to social norms.

It's kinda the othe way around, people shown tits and V's in both Twitter and Reddit, (rip Tumblr) heck there's a R 18+ subbreddit that is over 1 million followers.
For KYM, I agree with you on that. It's a small site, cannot defend itself.
-
Since that this site's growth was responsible for the Admins to be a bit restrictive on NSFW entries such as Hentai Quotes and the POMF meme, then I understand about that.

I did a double check and it seems currently all NSFW pages have their ads disabled.

Never noticed it either.

@pooch

Daily dose was a little more than just nudity.

Yes yes it contains some gay porn even though it lasted for like 7 years and became a running joke in KYM for a while.

so·ci·e·ty A group of people broadly distinguished from other groups by mutual interests, participation in characteristic relationships, shared institutions, and a common culture definition 1b.

Organized religion is a form of shared institution. I mention this because your example that you provide about how the only people you think are " terrified of female breasts" happen to be 3 of the largest religions in the world. That would constitute, by definition, a society which you yourself provided an example of.

Now you may argue "Well I don't mean everybody in those religions" and you would be right, not everybody that follow those religions may necessarily feel the same way about the female nipple. However, when we're talking about societal norms, we aren't referring to the few who think otherwise but the majority who do have an issue with the topic.

How many people do you figure roughly account for the worlds population that fall under those religions? Its more than a few. All i'm getting at is that this isn't some antiquated notion that just a couple million people believe in versus the billions of other people in the world who would suggest otherwise.

Personally, i wouldn't care much either way if things remained the same, or if KYM were to allow nipples. I'm simply clarifying for you some questions that you have been asking since the start of this thread about "what does everybody mean when they refer to 'society' ".

I don't care to argue about this, nor will that stop you from making some form of rebuttal trying to disprove me otherwise.

Frankly, this whole thread is pointless in trying to introduce any form of thoughts challenging your perspective Pooch since you just rebuke everything anyone has said.

@StoneColdKillerWhale
>That would constitute, by definition, a society

You understand that means getting rid of lgbt entries, right? Those people don't like lgbt people and islamic societies want the entirety of women covered, not just their nipples.

>However, when we're talking about societal norms, we aren't referring to the few who think otherwise but the majority who do have an issue with the topic.

get ready for a mass removal of lgbt entries then

"68% of the world (78% Africa, 77% Asia, 64% Americas, 61% Europe, 44% Oceania) would be upset (‘very’ or ‘somewhat’) if their child told them that they were in love with some-one of the same sex"

"only 28% world-wide (17% Africa, 25% Asia, 31% Americas, 34% Europe, 49% Oceania) would find it acceptable if a male child always dressed and expressed himself as a girl."

have fun living in the stone age of social progression if you think we should just cater to the majority's sensitivities.

…Oh joy. Of course the first logical thing to do is suddenly bring up sexuality as a topic because that is totally what i was discussing, and where the discussion was OBVIOUSLY leading to.

This is what is known as a non-sequitur.

Also don't be an asshole and try to put words in my mouth. You can say and believe whatever you want and i'll respect your choice 100% even if I personally disagree, BUT don't go pulling that BS on me.

>Also don't be an asshole and try to put words in my mouth.
?? Did you not say
"However, when we're talking about societal norms, we aren't referring to the few who think otherwise but the majority who do have an issue with the topic."

Mods: "We cannot allow uncensored, uncovered female breasts to be shown on our site because that runs the risk of sacrificing what little advertising this site has left."
Pooch:

Honestly pooch didn’t think this one through

You fool the thread was one day from locking and being forgotten about.

nice